Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[Tim Grimmett]

We do handicap at local tournaments here in DC. Our experience is removing
troops is not enough. Instead we give nonqualifiers a +200 point bonus at the
conclusion of the game when it is time to compute the winner. This has the
added benefit of allowing the qualifier to tinker with his 1600 point list and
play the army he wants to take to the NICT.

Tim

kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@...> wrote:
I like the idea of a handicap here. That means more NICT qualifiers with more
friends to visit with in Lancaster! :)

kelly wilkinson

JonCleaves@... wrote:

In a message dated 2/2/2005 23:02:11 Central Standard Time,
tors1@... writes:

Examples.
As a Tournament winner (Master) perhaps the loss of 100 pts worth of
troops against a novice who has never played in a tournament would be
fair. Players with other results could loose other amounts according
to their rankings.

Kingo >>


I know the capital region boys here in the US do exactly that. We in KC are
planning to have our next Warrior league handicap those who are qualified
for the NICT. Good idea, in my mind.

We'll just agree to disagree on the B-armed elephant thing. Of course, if
you'd like an explanation, you can send me an offline message. Please include
an explanation of 'furphy' that shows it is not perjorative...lol

Jon









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Tim,

That's an excellent idea. Hopefully we will do something similar to that
here in the Kansas City area. . . ! Shapur, do you have your scribes on this
one?!?

Kelly
The player formerly known as
Antiochus III

Tim Grimmett <grimmetttim@...> wrote:
We do handicap at local tournaments here in DC. Our experience is removing
troops is not enough. Instead we give nonqualifiers a +200 point bonus at the
conclusion of the game when it is time to compute the winner. This has the
added benefit of allowing the qualifier to tinker with his 1600 point list and
play the army he wants to take to the NICT.

Tim

kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@...> wrote:
I like the idea of a handicap here. That means more NICT qualifiers with more
friends to visit with in Lancaster! :)

kelly wilkinson

JonCleaves@... wrote:

In a message dated 2/2/2005 23:02:11 Central Standard Time,
tors1@... writes:

Examples.
As a Tournament winner (Master) perhaps the loss of 100 pts worth of
troops against a novice who has never played in a tournament would be
fair. Players with other results could loose other amounts according
to their rankings.

Kingo >>


I know the capital region boys here in the US do exactly that. We in KC are
planning to have our next Warrior league handicap those who are qualified
for the NICT. Good idea, in my mind.

We'll just agree to disagree on the B-armed elephant thing. Of course, if
you'd like an explanation, you can send me an offline message. Please include
an explanation of 'furphy' that shows it is not perjorative...lol

Jon









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Charles Yaw]

I personally don't like this type of handicapping system. It is
artifical and distorts the results. Sure, we want to get as many of
our local players to qualify as possible, but I don't think adding
points to the results of games is the answer. Getting more players
involved and improving the quality of play is a better answer IMO.
Both of which we have done and will continue to try to do here in
KC.

Charles (Shapur)

>
> That's an excellent idea. Hopefully we will do something
similar to that here in the Kansas City area. . . ! Shapur, do you
have your scribes on this one?!?
>
> Kelly
> The player formerly
known as Antiochus III
>
> Tim Grimmett <grimmetttim@y...> wrote:
> We do handicap at local tournaments here in DC. Our experience is
removing troops is not enough. Instead we give nonqualifiers a +200
point bonus at the conclusion of the game when it is time to compute
the winner. This has the added benefit of allowing the qualifier to
tinker with his 1600 point list and play the army he wants to take to
the NICT.
>
> Tim
>
> kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> I like the idea of a handicap here. That means more NICT qualifiers
with more friends to visit with in Lancaster!
>
> kelly
wilkinson
>
> JonCleaves@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 2/2/2005 23:02:11 Central Standard Time,
> tors1@o... writes:
>
> Examples.
> As a Tournament winner (Master) perhaps the loss of 100 pts worth
of
> troops against a novice who has never played in a tournament
would be
> fair. Players with other results could loose other amounts
according
> to their rankings.
>
> Kingo >>
>
>
> I know the capital region boys here in the US do exactly that. We
in KC are
> planning to have our next Warrior league handicap those who are
qualified
> for the NICT. Good idea, in my mind.
>
> We'll just agree to disagree on the B-armed elephant thing. Of
course, if
> you'd like an explanation, you can send me an offline message.
Please include
> an explanation of 'furphy' that shows it is not perjorative...lol
>
> Jon
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Greg Regets]

Long ago in TOG, we used both a ranking and handicapping system
designed to "help & protect" our newer players from regular death and
destruction at the hands of those at the top of the food chain.

All it really did was give those at the top of the food chain, more
quality repetitions in a tournament setting, against other solid
players, and limit the chances newer players had to learn from the
more experienced. All this did was widen the gap between the have's
and the have nots.

Way back when I first started playing, we used a scoring system that
topped out at about a 500 point margin between the winner and loser.
One you hit that margin, there was really no reason to "run up the
score" on a new guy. As a newer player, I remember many games against
old hats, where they would spend half the game getting thier points
(by kicking my butt), and then be completely free to spend the rest
of the game helping and teaching me how to play.

The current scoring system, in my opinion, offers motivation to trash
new players, and is a huge road block to the sportmanship I remember
from when I was a newbie.

Thanks ... g




--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "riderofrohan2001" <yaw@m...>
wrote:
>
> I personally don't like this type of handicapping system. It is
> artifical and distorts the results. Sure, we want to get as many
of
> our local players to qualify as possible, but I don't think adding
> points to the results of games is the answer. Getting more players
> involved and improving the quality of play is a better answer IMO.
> Both of which we have done and will continue to try to do here in
> KC.
>
> Charles (Shapur)
>
> >
> > That's an excellent idea. Hopefully we will do something
> similar to that here in the Kansas City area. . . ! Shapur, do you
> have your scribes on this one?!?
> >
> > Kelly
> > The player formerly
> known as Antiochus III
> >
> > Tim Grimmett <grimmetttim@y...> wrote:
> > We do handicap at local tournaments here in DC. Our experience
is
> removing troops is not enough. Instead we give nonqualifiers a
+200
> point bonus at the conclusion of the game when it is time to
compute
> the winner. This has the added benefit of allowing the qualifier
to
> tinker with his 1600 point list and play the army he wants to take
to
> the NICT.
> >
> > Tim
> >
> > kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > I like the idea of a handicap here. That means more NICT
qualifiers
> with more friends to visit with in Lancaster!
> >
> > kelly
> wilkinson
> >
> > JonCleaves@a... wrote:
> >
> > In a message dated 2/2/2005 23:02:11 Central Standard Time,
> > tors1@o... writes:
> >
> > Examples.
> > As a Tournament winner (Master) perhaps the loss of 100 pts
worth
> of
> > troops against a novice who has never played in a tournament
> would be
> > fair. Players with other results could loose other amounts
> according
> > to their rankings.
> >
> > Kingo >>
> >
> >
> > I know the capital region boys here in the US do exactly that.
We
> in KC are
> > planning to have our next Warrior league handicap those who are
> qualified
> > for the NICT. Good idea, in my mind.
> >
> > We'll just agree to disagree on the B-armed elephant thing. Of
> course, if
> > you'd like an explanation, you can send me an offline message.
> Please include
> > an explanation of 'furphy' that shows it is not perjorative...lol
> >
> > Jon
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Charles Yaw]

> All it really did was give those at the top of the food chain, more
> quality repetitions in a tournament setting, against other solid
> players, and limit the chances newer players had to learn from the
> more experienced. All this did was widen the gap between the have's
> and the have nots.

I agree with this completely. You get better by playing against
quality opposition. Good players will show you your mistakes in ways
you are likely to remember :)

>and then be completely free to spend the rest of the game helping
>and teaching me how to play.

We try to do teaching games for this purpose. We also try to discuss
games after they are played to point out what went right and what
could have been better.

> The current scoring system, in my opinion, offers motivation to
>trash new players, and is a huge road block to the sportmanship I
>remember from when I was a newbie.

I don't see the scoring system as a road block to sportsmanship, but
there certainly is a bias in favor of getting a 5 point win. In
Warrior, as in most games, there are times to "bring it" and games
that are more laid back. And tactics can be discussed following
every game, tournament or not.

Charles


>
> Thanks ... g
>
>
>
>
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "riderofrohan2001" <yaw@m...>
> wrote:
> >
> > I personally don't like this type of handicapping system. It is
> > artifical and distorts the results. Sure, we want to get as many
> of
> > our local players to qualify as possible, but I don't think
adding
> > points to the results of games is the answer. Getting more
players
> > involved and improving the quality of play is a better answer
IMO.
> > Both of which we have done and will continue to try to do here in
> > KC.
> >
> > Charles (Shapur)
> >
> > >
> > > That's an excellent idea. Hopefully we will do something
> > similar to that here in the Kansas City area. . . ! Shapur, do
you
> > have your scribes on this one?!?
> > >
> > >
Kelly
> > > The player
formerly
> > known as Antiochus III
> > >
> > > Tim Grimmett <grimmetttim@y...> wrote:
> > > We do handicap at local tournaments here in DC. Our experience
> is
> > removing troops is not enough. Instead we give nonqualifiers a
> +200
> > point bonus at the conclusion of the game when it is time to
> compute
> > the winner. This has the added benefit of allowing the qualifier
> to
> > tinker with his 1600 point list and play the army he wants to
take
> to
> > the NICT.
> > >
> > > Tim
> > >
> > > kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > > I like the idea of a handicap here. That means more NICT
> qualifiers
> > with more friends to visit with in Lancaster!
> > >
> > > kelly
> > wilkinson
> > >
> > > JonCleaves@a... wrote:
> > >
> > > In a message dated 2/2/2005 23:02:11 Central Standard Time,
> > > tors1@o... writes:
> > >
> > > Examples.
> > > As a Tournament winner (Master) perhaps the loss of 100 pts
> worth
> > of
> > > troops against a novice who has never played in a tournament
> > would be
> > > fair. Players with other results could loose other amounts
> > according
> > > to their rankings.
> > >
> > > Kingo >>
> > >
> > >
> > > I know the capital region boys here in the US do exactly that.
> We
> > in KC are
> > > planning to have our next Warrior league handicap those who
are
> > qualified
> > > for the NICT. Good idea, in my mind.
> > >
> > > We'll just agree to disagree on the B-armed elephant thing.
Of
> > course, if
> > > you'd like an explanation, you can send me an offline
message.
> > Please include
> > > an explanation of 'furphy' that shows it is not
perjorative...lol
> > >
> > > Jon
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> > Service.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> > Service.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> > Service.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[joncleaves]

The current scoring system, in my opinion, offers motivation to trash
new players, and is a huge road block to the sportmanship I remember
from when I was a newbie.>>

You might look at not using the + for +150 and for 2x points in such games.
Once you get to 401 there is no reason to kill more....

However, having taught dozens of people 7th/Warrior, I don't see any reason to
handicap, at least as part of teaching goes. I wasn't played soft when I was
learning and I don't play soft those I teach. I have watched many players work
from 0 or 1 - 5 to 2 or 1 - 2 or 1 to getting 4s and 5s and the enjoyment they
got from 'earning' their wins.

My only suggestion on handicaps was to qualify more players, not at all as a
teaching tool..

Jon

[joncleaves]

I don't see the scoring system as a road block to sportsmanship,>>

I am with Charles. Sportsmanship and a scoring system are not related in my
mind. But, hey, that's me.

<< but
there certainly is a bias in favor of getting a 5 point win. >>

True, but only if you use the standard scoring system. There certainly is no
requirement to and the revised rules will offer other options for those who do
not like it.

Jon

[Greg Regets]

I suppose that depends on the event, and I would also suppose I
should have made that more clear in my last post. In an NICT
environment, the current scoring system is probably the best. In a
small local affair with one or two new players, it is probably not
quite as good.

Jon, would is be helpful to FHE, to have some other scoring methods
sent you you offline?

g


--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, JonCleaves@a... wrote:
> I don't see the scoring system as a road block to sportsmanship,>>
>
> I am with Charles. Sportsmanship and a scoring system are not
related in my mind. But, hey, that's me.
>
> << but
> there certainly is a bias in favor of getting a 5 point win. >>
>
> True, but only if you use the standard scoring system. There
certainly is no requirement to and the revised rules will offer other
options for those who do not like it.
>
> Jon

[joncleaves]

Jon, would is be helpful to FHE, to have some other scoring methods
sent you you offline?>>

Hell yes. I will include as many alternate competition deployment and scoring
schemes as I can.
We are always open to *new* ideas. :)

J

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Charles,

So do you believe that what the DC guys are doing is artificial? You may
have a very good point. Perhaps this sort of thing is not right. Now after
further review it doesn't send deserving players to the big show. This probably
proves the point that the best aren't necessarily the only ones being invited to
the NICT. . . So why is this being allowed by the powers that be who should be
controlling this sort of behavior?

kelly wilkinson

riderofrohan2001 <yaw@...> wrote:

I personally don't like this type of handicapping system. It is
artifical and distorts the results. Sure, we want to get as many of
our local players to qualify as possible, but I don't think adding
points to the results of games is the answer. Getting more players
involved and improving the quality of play is a better answer IMO.
Both of which we have done and will continue to try to do here in
KC.

Charles (Shapur)

>
> That's an excellent idea. Hopefully we will do something
similar to that here in the Kansas City area. . . ! Shapur, do you
have your scribes on this one?!?
>
> Kelly
> The player formerly
known as Antiochus III
>
> Tim Grimmett <grimmetttim@y...> wrote:
> We do handicap at local tournaments here in DC. Our experience is
removing troops is not enough. Instead we give nonqualifiers a +200
point bonus at the conclusion of the game when it is time to compute
the winner. This has the added benefit of allowing the qualifier to
tinker with his 1600 point list and play the army he wants to take to
the NICT.
>
> Tim
>
> kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> I like the idea of a handicap here. That means more NICT qualifiers
with more friends to visit with in Lancaster!
>
> kelly
wilkinson
>
> JonCleaves@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 2/2/2005 23:02:11 Central Standard Time,
> tors1@o... writes:
>
> Examples.
> As a Tournament winner (Master) perhaps the loss of 100 pts worth
of
> troops against a novice who has never played in a tournament
would be
> fair. Players with other results could loose other amounts
according
> to their rankings.
>
> Kingo >>
>
>
> I know the capital region boys here in the US do exactly that. We
in KC are
> planning to have our next Warrior league handicap those who are
qualified
> for the NICT. Good idea, in my mind.
>
> We'll just agree to disagree on the B-armed elephant thing. Of
course, if
> you'd like an explanation, you can send me an offline message.
Please include
> an explanation of 'furphy' that shows it is not perjorative...lol
>
> Jon
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Greg,

In the last Texas Tournament I participated in, my first opponent was very
inexperienced. As I recall, I actually had him change his moves b/c they were
going to cause him to be outflanked and lose 5-0 in less than 2 or 3 turns. The
game turned into a class on how to play longbows and knights as a combined arms
team. I did this because I couldn't bear to crush a new player. My buddy who
came down with me had the same situation in his first round. It's nice that we
did that, but what I did bothered me b/c I could've been a contenda. Had I not
tanked that game and helped the new guy (who was very thrilled that I helped him
out), I would have been playing for one of the top positions. Instead of going
for the kill I played for relatively few points. Tournaments are good for
learning valuable lessons, but are not for training. Training should happen
before and after tournaments. New players that enter a competition with Vetrans
who they know will most likely smoke them, but expect
them to help during said tourney, are not being realistic. That's not really
the point of the tournament ( the point is to have a great time and someone is
going to win). Here in Kansas City, we try to help out our newer player who may
not always end up with a great showing with prizes in the lower placings and
with help before and after said tournaments by playing learning games and doing
AAR's. I believe Todd wrote a very interesting note about AAR's on this group
many, many posts ago. They are worth looking at for new players who are
interested in improving their game.

kelly

kelly

Greg Regets <greg.regets@...> wrote:

Long ago in TOG, we used both a ranking and handicapping system
designed to "help & protect" our newer players from regular death and
destruction at the hands of those at the top of the food chain.

All it really did was give those at the top of the food chain, more
quality repetitions in a tournament setting, against other solid
players, and limit the chances newer players had to learn from the
more experienced. All this did was widen the gap between the have's
and the have nots.

Way back when I first started playing, we used a scoring system that
topped out at about a 500 point margin between the winner and loser.
One you hit that margin, there was really no reason to "run up the
score" on a new guy. As a newer player, I remember many games against
old hats, where they would spend half the game getting thier points
(by kicking my butt), and then be completely free to spend the rest
of the game helping and teaching me how to play.

The current scoring system, in my opinion, offers motivation to trash
new players, and is a huge road block to the sportmanship I remember
from when I was a newbie.

Thanks ... g




--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "riderofrohan2001" <yaw@m...>
wrote:
>
> I personally don't like this type of handicapping system. It is
> artifical and distorts the results. Sure, we want to get as many
of
> our local players to qualify as possible, but I don't think adding
> points to the results of games is the answer. Getting more players
> involved and improving the quality of play is a better answer IMO.
> Both of which we have done and will continue to try to do here in
> KC.
>
> Charles (Shapur)
>
> >
> > That's an excellent idea. Hopefully we will do something
> similar to that here in the Kansas City area. . . ! Shapur, do you
> have your scribes on this one?!?
> >
> > Kelly
> > The player formerly
> known as Antiochus III
> >
> > Tim Grimmett <grimmetttim@y...> wrote:
> > We do handicap at local tournaments here in DC. Our experience
is
> removing troops is not enough. Instead we give nonqualifiers a
+200
> point bonus at the conclusion of the game when it is time to
compute
> the winner. This has the added benefit of allowing the qualifier
to
> tinker with his 1600 point list and play the army he wants to take
to
> the NICT.
> >
> > Tim
> >
> > kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > I like the idea of a handicap here. That means more NICT
qualifiers
> with more friends to visit with in Lancaster!
> >
> > kelly
> wilkinson
> >
> > JonCleaves@a... wrote:
> >
> > In a message dated 2/2/2005 23:02:11 Central Standard Time,
> > tors1@o... writes:
> >
> > Examples.
> > As a Tournament winner (Master) perhaps the loss of 100 pts
worth
> of
> > troops against a novice who has never played in a tournament
> would be
> > fair. Players with other results could loose other amounts
> according
> > to their rankings.
> >
> > Kingo >>
> >
> >
> > I know the capital region boys here in the US do exactly that.
We
> in KC are
> > planning to have our next Warrior league handicap those who are
> qualified
> > for the NICT. Good idea, in my mind.
> >
> > We'll just agree to disagree on the B-armed elephant thing. Of
> course, if
> > you'd like an explanation, you can send me an offline message.
> Please include
> > an explanation of 'furphy' that shows it is not perjorative...lol
> >
> > Jon
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Greg Preston]

Re handicapping

In a comp with a reasonable number of players using the Swiss chess
matchup system this seems to be less of a problem for us here in
Australia.

In game one the better players tend to get big wins against the newer
players- . usually by round 3 or 4 the new guys are playing players
who have also been -trashed- earlier in the comp and therefore are more
likely to be taking part in even games.

Thus they get the chance to learn from the better players early in the
comp and get the chance to chalk up some points later in the comp.


We only have problems if the comp is made up of "gun" players with one
or two newbies. But let me tell you-if the newbies are competitive
-they doing there best to graft points from the top of the table
players even in these situations.

I am not sure that -rewarding- newbies with extra points is the way to
go. It the recent Australia 15mm Championships we had a player in his
first comp in with a chance to win the thing going into the last game.
Admittedly, he was very switched on and had been a very competitive
player under WAB- but the fact that he did so well on an even playing
field was I think more rewarding than if it had been assisted by
-newbie- points.



Greg P.

[joncleaves]

but the fact that he did so well on an even playing
field was I think more rewarding than if it had been assisted by
-newbie- points.>>

the Lord bless down under...lol

J

[Tim Grimmett]

Bingo. The point is not to "soften" the blow. It is not unknown for a guy
still gets blown out 5-2, with the handicap, at the hands of an experienced
player.

Furthermore, since we've instituted the handicap, we have yet to have the
handicap play a decisive role in getting a newbie qualified.

It does give the experienced player an edge at getting qualified and allow the
qualified players to continue playing the army of their choice.

What is the point if region has a stud player that can routinely beat his peers
(Eric Turner springs to mind in our group) and he is our only representative at
the NICT? Until the handicap, we had players playing tier two or three armies,
but they were forgoing the chance to practice their NICT army.

The handicap system we've worked out meets all our needs.

JonCleaves@... wrote:
My only suggestion on handicaps was to qualify more players, not at all as a
teaching tool..

Jon



---------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Tim Grimmett]

Kelly--

Take a deep breath and read my latest post.

Tim



kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@...> wrote:
Charles,

So do you believe that what the DC guys are doing is artificial? You may
have a very good point. Perhaps this sort of thing is not right. Now after
further review it doesn't send deserving players to the big show. This probably
proves the point that the best aren't necessarily the only ones being invited to
the NICT. . . So why is this being allowed by the powers that be who should be
controlling this sort of behavior?



---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]