Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[Mark Stone]

What follows aren't rules questions, really. More of rules observations. In refereeing at Kubla Con, I found two points that people consistently overlooked in the rules, and thinking back I believe these are points on which people often tend to be a bit casual. I'm not sure if there's a fix here, other than to admonish people to pay closer attention.

The first point has to do with passing gaps. The rules are crystal clear that when freely dropping elements to pass a gap, the only such gaps for which you can do this are gaps which are narrower than the body passing the gap. Here's a typical example of where people run afoul of this:

- Genghis has a 6 stand body in a 3 wide, 2 deep formation
- Alexander is opposing Genghis with a 6 stand body in a 3 wide, 2 deep formation, but offset so that one element's frontage projects out.
- Genghis has a 4 stand body in a 2x2 formation; one of the two element's frontage is behind Genghis' 6 stand body, and the other is lined up with Alexander's projecting element.
- No other units, terrain features, or board edges are within 2 elements of any of the three bodies in question here.

In this situation, contrary to several attempts I witnessed (and ruled against) at Kubla Con, Genghis' 4 stand body cannot charge Alexander's 6 stand body, because there is no sufficiently narrow gap to enable it to freely drop elements to pass by Genghis' 6 stand body.

So that's the first confusion. Here's the second. Quoting, from 6.52, "No body may interpenetrate more than one body in a phase...."

This means, for example, that if a light infantry unit has two friendly bodies behind it that are 40p and 60p from its rear respectively, that it cannot interpenetrate both in an evade.

Now, these two rules -- gaps and interpenetration -- interact in an interesting way. Consider the LI with the staggered friendly units behind it. To be able to evade beyond these, the LI must contract when it meets the first so that that becomes the only body it interpenetrates. However, the LI can only contract in this manner if doing so enables it to pass a gap narrower than the LI.

Suffice it to say, this will often not be the case. When a contraction is not possible, an interpenetration is not possible, and thus the LI will stop its evade when it reaches the first friendly body and just sit there in front of it. There's an excellent chance this will result in the LI being caught in its evade and routed.

I don't know how intentional all of this is on Jon's part. I suspect quite intentional. Warrior places very heavy penalties on not dressing your lines properly and keeping units properly spaced. This is a much bigger deal in Warrior than it ever was in WRG7, and I suspect a lot of us are still playing fast and loose WRG style.

I'll try and post some kind of action report later on, but I thought these rules issues were particularly interesting, and I suspect we're not the only group that has gotten into bad habits.


-Mark Stone

[joncleaves]

Awesome post, Mark. You have it exactly right and yes it is quite intentional for exactly the reasons you state.

Jon

[scott holder]

Part of Mark's post confuses me in terms of "is that correct", this having to do with the evade. He describes the LI having to stop in front of the first body it meets since it can't interpentrate both bodies.

OTOH, would the evading LI interpentrate the first body met but then stop in front of the second body? This is hugely complicated by space needed by the LI body to fit", or would the various bodies in question be pushed around to make space?

This second case clearly needs and umpire since two players seldom agree on what goes where.

If the first case (you're stuck if your move would take you into that second body, thus, it precludes *any* interpentration move whatsoever) is true, than it's much cleaner.

scott

[Bill Chriss]

My reaction is exactly the same as Scott's. Why couldn't the LI interpenetrate the first unit and "stay interpenetrated" until the results of the evade/pursuit were adjudicated? If it gets hit, it gets hit and postcombat movement would probably resolve any traffic jam or hanging/stacked elements. (and wouldn't the [post-combat movement constitute a different phase?) If it doesn't get caught, then the mess is unraveled by movement next bound. Mark has identified one mechanic that I agreee causes much confusion (including in my own mind).

[Mark Stone]

[Bill Chriss]

Yes. I know this has caught me unawares several times, so I would appreciate a refresher course. Mark, have you considered moving this to the rules topic so Jon can verify?

[Mark Stone]

OK, I have a diagram up in the Files section now that illustrates how gap rules and interpenetration rules conspire to jeopoardize LI in an evade. -Mark Stone

[Bill Chriss]

I went there and pushed "download," but to no avail. I appear to be getting a message that I am not authorized to download the slideshow. Is this perhaps and inadequacy in my software? I'll try some other diagrams to se what luck I have.

In any event, I do get the point, as your written description was very helpful. I was just rusty on the business of when elements are allowed to "hang out" or be split by an interpenetrated body. I suppose the point is to never, ever, have a line that is three bodies deep. Thanks for the help.

[Martin Williams]

Hi

got done over by this (new in Aus) interpretation of the evade rules just the other night (I knew I should have kept up with reading the posts). The LI's choice to stop running and die seems hard to understand. What is this intended to represent??

Martin

[Martin Williams]

Hi

got done over by this (new in Aus) interpretation of the evade rules just the other night (I knew I should have kept up with reading the posts). The LI's choice to stop running and die seems hard to understand. What is this intended to represent??

Martin