Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

Mysteriously, I didn't get digest number 1820.

Could someone copy me on it?

Thanks,
Chris Cameron

WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com wrote:

>There are 7 messages in this issue.
>
>Topics in this digest:
>
> 1. Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
> From: Todd Kaeser <hailkaeser@...>
> 2. Re: Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
> From: JonCleaves@...
> 3. Re: Re: Misquoting Jon
> From: JonCleaves@...
> 4. Re: Re: Misquoting Jon
> From: Todd Schneider <thresh1642@...>
> 5. Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
> From: kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@...>
> 6. Re: Digest Number 1820
> From: Mark L Duncan <mark_duncan@...>
> 7. Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
> From: "jwilkinson62" <jwilkinson62@...>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
>________________________________________________________________________
>
>Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 14:20:16 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Todd Kaeser <hailkaeser@...>
>Subject: Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
>
>Mark,
>
>Old Glory 15's also have Mongols - I bought some of the dismounted figures and
they look good. Cheaper and a little bigger than essex - I looked at the cav
and it also was nice.
>
>Todd K
>
>Mark Stone <mark@...> wrote:
>--- On August 1 Mike Turner said: ---
>
>
>
>>Well Mark, now that we have all told you how to get your fig's, 2000
>>points of Mongols?? Plan on also painting dismounts for your cavalry
>>I imagine? This will solve the long discussion on Terrain, you can
>>simply pick up the piece of offending enemy terrain and discard it!
>>
>>
>>
>
>Well, the tournament gamer in me wouldn't pick Mongols as a first choice,
>especially on 2000 points. Timurids would be a better choice. But Alex doesn't
>care about tournament optimization; he cares about historical interest. He did
>a big report for school this past year on the Mongols, and has developed great
>admiration for Genghis Khan as a leader, and Subotai as a general. So Mongols
>it is.
>
>Now, don't get me wrong; Mongols is a fine list. At 1200 points it may be the
>best list out there, particularly when the norm is to allow only one version of
>a list. The dismount rule gives the Mongols effectively two versions of the
list
>out of a single version, which makes a huge difference.
>
>At 1600 points I think it's still a strong list, and can work well in either
>15mm or 25mm. But at 2000 points, I think it's just too cumbersome to work in
>25mm. Hence the switch to 15mm....
>
>And since I already have a Post Mongol Russian army in 15mm, I have most of the
>figures I need.
>
>Yes, I'll be painting up dismounts for a bunch of cav, as the dismount rule is
>one of the big reasons to play the list. And yes, terrain will certainly be
>easy to pack (4 loops of string). And on 2000 points I think there are some
>other gimmicks one can afford that make the list more interesting....
>
>
>-Mark Stone
>
>
>SPONSORED LINKS
>Miniature wargaming Wargaming Four horsemen Warrior
>
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>
>Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 17:31:47 -0400
> From: JonCleaves@...
>Subject: Re: Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
>
>Actually Mike is right. Kelly did indeed act counter to my wishes as I have
asked him 1000 times not to use my name in any way whatsoever. He did indeed
misquote me as well.
>
>If Kelly can continue to do what he does here, I can hardly fault Mike T for
calling him out on it. Kelly did not technically break any rules of the forum
and neither did Mike - who can hardly be called the antagonist here. Noting
that I block his mail is hardly any sort of offense and not at all in a category
with deliberately ignoring my request not to have anything to do with me or, as
an example, berating someone because they did not think of Wargames when Essex
figs were mentioned.
>
>I do indeed block Kelly's mail because I have given up expecting him to observe
other's wishes. Mike T does indeed know Kelly's motives because he has to deal
with him being in our playing area as do I.
>
>I would rather just not have anything like this at all here - so, letting this
all die would be the best course of action.
>
>Jon
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael <stuntz@...>
>To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
>Sent: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 19:28:16 -0000
>Subject: [WarriorRules] Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
>
>
>Mike
>
>I normally just lurk on this list but I must say something this time
>I do not see anything wrong with what or how Kelly stated his
>understanding of Jon's position. It would appear to me that you are
>the antagonist in this case!
>
>1) Kelly is not misquoting Jon because I heard Jon tell a
>player at Historicon 2005 that he (Jon) felt they were the same game.
>2) You are claiming you know Kelly's motives.
>3) There is no need to tell the list that Jon blocks his or
>anyone elses' emails. That is Jon's business and not the list.
>
>That's all I have to say about that because this list is not the
>forum to discuss this topic but I could not hold my piece any longer.
>
>
>
>--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "turner1118" <Turnerm@l...>
>wrote:
>
>
>>Kelly,
>>I know for a fact Jon does not appreciate you misquoting him.
>>
>>Jon has said the game at 15mm and 25mm is the same because it is.
>>The same numbers are used to compute missile fire, combat, etc.
>>
>>
>The
>
>
>>same rules hold for counters, retirements, wavers, etc.
>>
>>The only difference is the size of the playing field to the army.
>>
>>Your misquoting him (was there really a need to use his name other
>>than to poke him? or start something?)is one of the reasons he
>>
>>
>blocks
>
>
>>your e-mails,
>>
>>Mike
>>
>>--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
>><jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Mark Stone Wrote:
>>>
>>>At 1600 points I think it's still a strong list, and can work
>>>
>>>
>well
>
>
>>in either
>>
>>
>>>15mm or 25mm. But at 2000 points, I think it's just too
>>>
>>>
>cumbersome
>
>
>>to work in
>>
>>
>>>25mm. Hence the switch to 15mm....
>>>
>>>
>>>Kelly writes:
>>>
>>>Mark, why do you think Mongols are better in 15mm? Jon and many
>>>
>>>
>>others believe that the 25mm game is the same as that of the 15mm
>>game. What is your reasoning in this?
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>SPONSORED LINKS
>>>Miniature wargaming Wargaming Four horsemen Warrior
>>>
>>>---------------------------------
>>>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>>>
>>>
>>> Visit your group "WarriorRules" on the web.
>>>
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>>>
>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
>>>
>>>
>>Service.
>>
>>
>>>---------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>
>
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>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
>________________________________________________________________________
>
>Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 17:35:45 -0400
> From: JonCleaves@...
>Subject: Re: Re: Misquoting Jon
>
>What an appropriate title to this thread...lol
>
>What I actually said was - 15mm and 25mm Warrior (meaning played on the table
sizes NASAMW keeps choosing to play on) are not so different as to require a
different National Championship for each. Of course there are minor differences
- the largest to me being the distance to table center in 15mm.
>
>I am *not* in favor of the two different table proportions and never have been.
Although misquoted, I am in the minority on this issue and am quite aware of
that. I also do not see it as something major.
>
>Which is my view of this discussion as well...lol
>
>Back to lobster rolls!
>Jon
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: eforbes100@... <eforbes100@...>
>To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
>Sent: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:52:22 GMT
>Subject: Re: [WarriorRules] Re: Misquoting Jon
>
>
>
>
>
>Come on guys, this thread seems to be way too heated for someone only stating
>that Jon seems to think that a game in Warrior in 15mm or 25mm plays close
>enough to be same.
>
>This thread has been discussed before and I, and many others, have come away
>with the impression that Jon sees no need to change the suggested table sizes
to
>make the tables in 15mm and 25mm the same by scale. As it is, there is a
>difference in scale of table width and depth, so the two different formats have
>to play differently. The argument is if the difference is enough to make a
>difference that matters in game play.
>
>I see no reason for personal attacks on the subject of Jon's earlier publicly
>stated views on table size in 15mm and 25mm.
>
>Ed
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
>________________________________________________________________________
>
>Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 14:49:39 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Todd Schneider <thresh1642@...>
>Subject: Re: Re: Misquoting Jon
>
>Aren't you getting tired of lobster yet?
>
>Todd
>
>--- JonCleaves@... wrote:
>
>
>
>>What an appropriate title to this thread...lol
>>
>>What I actually said was - 15mm and 25mm Warrior
>>(meaning played on the table sizes NASAMW keeps
>>choosing to play on) are not so different as to
>>require a different National Championship for each.
>>Of course there are minor differences - the largest
>>to me being the distance to table center in 15mm.
>>
>>I am *not* in favor of the two different table
>>proportions and never have been. Although
>>misquoted, I am in the minority on this issue and am
>>quite aware of that. I also do not see it as
>>something major.
>>
>>Which is my view of this discussion as well...lol
>>
>>Back to lobster rolls!
>>Jon
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: eforbes100@... <eforbes100@...>
>>To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
>>Sent: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 20:52:22 GMT
>>Subject: Re: [WarriorRules] Re: Misquoting Jon
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Come on guys, this thread seems to be way too heated
>>for someone only stating
>>that Jon seems to think that a game in Warrior in
>>15mm or 25mm plays close
>>enough to be same.
>>
>>This thread has been discussed before and I, and
>>many others, have come away
>>with the impression that Jon sees no need to change
>>the suggested table sizes to
>>make the tables in 15mm and 25mm the same by scale.
>>As it is, there is a
>>difference in scale of table width and depth, so the
>>two different formats have
>>to play differently. The argument is if the
>>difference is enough to make a
>>difference that matters in game play.
>>
>>I see no reason for personal attacks on the subject
>>of Jon's earlier publicly
>>stated views on table size in 15mm and 25mm.
>>
>>Ed
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>[Non-text portions of this message have been
>>removed]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
>________________________________________________________________________
>
>Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:02:25 -0700 (PDT)
> From: kelly wilkinson <jwilkinson62@...>
>Subject: Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
>
>Todd,
>
> Do you have a website with pictures?
>
> kelly
>
>Todd Kaeser <hailkaeser@...> wrote:
>Mark,
>
>Old Glory 15's also have Mongols - I bought some of the dismounted figures and
they look good. Cheaper and a little bigger than essex - I looked at the cav
and it also was nice.
>
>Todd K
>
>Mark Stone <mark@...> wrote:
>--- On August 1 Mike Turner said: ---
>
>
>
>>Well Mark, now that we have all told you how to get your fig's, 2000
>>points of Mongols?? Plan on also painting dismounts for your cavalry
>>I imagine? This will solve the long discussion on Terrain, you can
>>simply pick up the piece of offending enemy terrain and discard it!
>>
>>
>>
>
>Well, the tournament gamer in me wouldn't pick Mongols as a first choice,
>especially on 2000 points. Timurids would be a better choice. But Alex doesn't
>care about tournament optimization; he cares about historical interest. He did
>a big report for school this past year on the Mongols, and has developed great
>admiration for Genghis Khan as a leader, and Subotai as a general. So Mongols
>it is.
>
>Now, don't get me wrong; Mongols is a fine list. At 1200 points it may be the
>best list out there, particularly when the norm is to allow only one version of
>a list. The dismount rule gives the Mongols effectively two versions of the
list
>out of a single version, which makes a huge difference.
>
>At 1600 points I think it's still a strong list, and can work well in either
>15mm or 25mm. But at 2000 points, I think it's just too cumbersome to work in
>25mm. Hence the switch to 15mm....
>
>And since I already have a Post Mongol Russian army in 15mm, I have most of the
>figures I need.
>
>Yes, I'll be painting up dismounts for a bunch of cav, as the dismount rule is
>one of the big reasons to play the list. And yes, terrain will certainly be
>easy to pack (4 loops of string). And on 2000 points I think there are some
>other gimmicks one can afford that make the list more interesting....
>
>
>-Mark Stone
>
>
>SPONSORED LINKS
>Miniature wargaming Wargaming Four horsemen Warrior
>
>---------------------------------
>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
>
> Visit your group "WarriorRules" on the web.
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>---------------------------------
>
>
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>SPONSORED LINKS
>Miniature wargaming Wargaming Four horsemen Warrior
>
>---------------------------------
>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
>
> Visit your group "WarriorRules" on the web.
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>---------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>---------------------------------
> Start your day with Yahoo! - make it your home page
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
>________________________________________________________________________
>
>Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2005 15:12:18 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Mark L Duncan <mark_duncan@...>
>Subject: Re: Digest Number 1820
>
>TABLE SCALE I think my 15mm Mongols like the table size better than if
they were 25mm, more room to snake around and slap thos slimy Greeks and Romans
that Mike and Kelly play
>
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
>________________________________________________________________________
>
>Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 22:27:28 -0000
> From: "jwilkinson62" <jwilkinson62@...>
>Subject: Re: Mongols (was: Essex in North America)
>
>--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "turner1118" <Turnerm@l...>
>wrote:
>
>
>>Kelly,
>>I know for a fact Jon does not appreciate you misquoting him.
>>
>>Jon has said the game at 15mm and 25mm is the same because it is.
>>
>>
>
>***Kelly***
>Mike just said the same thing I said in his mail rebuking me! But
>I'm blamed for misquoting someone. How can I be misquoting anyone
>here when the antagonist states that this is a fact? This whole
>thing is insane. I was referring to Marks 2,000 point Mongol army
>when I asked for his opinion. That was the gist of the post. It's
>old news how some feel about the 25mm game verses the 15mm game. I
>like both the way they are. I never took any position. Never
>misquoted anyone. For those that didn't read the above comment. look
>read, then read what I read. I just wanted to know what Mark's
>reasoning was. That was ALL. Unless your a bunch of mind readers,
>which by the way, your not, because if you were, you would never
>have started this silliness, take it for what it is. . . A question
>about Mark's reason for playing 2,000 points of Mongols in 15mm over
>25mm. That's all it was. No reason to get mad or ruffled.
>
> kelly wilkinson
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>>The same numbers are used to compute missile fire, combat, etc.
>>
>>
>The
>
>
>>same rules hold for counters, retirements, wavers, etc.
>>
>>The only difference is the size of the playing field to the army.
>>
>>Your misquoting him (was there really a need to use his name other
>>than to poke him? or start something?)is one of the reasons he
>>
>>
>blocks
>
>
>>your e-mails,
>>
>>Mike
>>
>>--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
>><jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Mark Stone Wrote:
>>>
>>>At 1600 points I think it's still a strong list, and can work
>>>
>>>
>well
>
>
>>in either
>>
>>
>>>15mm or 25mm. But at 2000 points, I think it's just too
>>>
>>>
>cumbersome
>
>
>>to work in
>>
>>
>>>25mm. Hence the switch to 15mm....
>>>
>>>
>>>Kelly writes:
>>>
>>>Mark, why do you think Mongols are better in 15mm? Jon and many
>>>
>>>
>>others believe that the 25mm game is the same as that of the 15mm
>>game. What is your reasoning in this?
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>SPONSORED LINKS
>>>Miniature wargaming Wargaming Four horsemen Warrior
>>>
>>>---------------------------------
>>>YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>>>
>>>
>>> Visit your group "WarriorRules" on the web.
>>>
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>> WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>>>
>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
>>>
>>>
>>Service.
>>
>>
>>>---------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>__________________________________________________
>>>Do You Yahoo!?
>>>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>>>http://mail.yahoo.com
>>>
>>>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
>________________________________________________________________________
>________________________________________________________________________
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
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>
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