Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[Greg Regets]

Harlan ...

Having served as the referee last weekend, I can say that my opinion
on army lists has done a complete 180.

I honestly feel that we should allow a short "Grandfathering" period
after an FHE list booklet is published to allow players to transition
to the new list, then require that only the FHE list be used.

Many people probably wish FHE would be more open-minded to list
issues that multiple players try to address, but there is no doubt
that the lists are VERY balanced, and give players a good shot at
having a level playing field at the start of the game.

Some of the other published lists are just not balanced, and forget
small details like "Flaming pigs may only be used if the opposing
army may have elephants." The result makes a troop type that
basically operates completely outside of it's historical model. This
is only one example.

Another point on this is strictly from a marketing support
perspective. We have to try to buy FHE stuff to help the company. As
much as I have ranted on these guys, they did bring a great game to
the hobby, and the least we owe them is financial support.

The last point is application of lists to new players. We have been
recruiting quite a bit as of late, and these new players do not have
access to some of the older lists. This is just not fair, from my
perspective.

So, to my way of thinking, we should move to the new lists as soon as
it is practicle. The positives far outweigh the negatives.

Now, if only I could find a list with a list rule to only allow the
army to roll up!

g

[Harlan Garrett]

Greg,

I have been think the same thing. Although we share some of the same
opinions, especially your last comment and there army four books and soon to
be five.

Harlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Regets [mailto:greg.regets@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 2:22 PM
To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


Harlan ...

Having served as the referee last weekend, I can say that my opinion
on army lists has done a complete 180.

I honestly feel that we should allow a short "Grandfathering" period
after an FHE list booklet is published to allow players to transition
to the new list, then require that only the FHE list be used.

Many people probably wish FHE would be more open-minded to list
issues that multiple players try to address, but there is no doubt
that the lists are VERY balanced, and give players a good shot at
having a level playing field at the start of the game.

Some of the other published lists are just not balanced, and forget
small details like "Flaming pigs may only be used if the opposing
army may have elephants." The result makes a troop type that
basically operates completely outside of it's historical model. This
is only one example.

Another point on this is strictly from a marketing support
perspective. We have to try to buy FHE stuff to help the company. As
much as I have ranted on these guys, they did bring a great game to
the hobby, and the least we owe them is financial support.

The last point is application of lists to new players. We have been
recruiting quite a bit as of late, and these new players do not have
access to some of the older lists. This is just not fair, from my
perspective.

So, to my way of thinking, we should move to the new lists as soon as
it is practicle. The positives far outweigh the negatives.

Now, if only I could find a list with a list rule to only allow the
army to roll up!

g



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[Harlan Garrett]

Correction

Five books soon to be six. I forgot about New World Warrior.

-----Original Message-----
From: Harlan D. Garrett [mailto:harlan.d.garrett@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 2:29 PM
To: 'WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


Greg,

I have been think the same thing. Although we share some of the same
opinions, especially your last comment and there army four books and soon to
be five.

Harlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Regets [mailto:greg.regets@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 2:22 PM
To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


Harlan ...

Having served as the referee last weekend, I can say that my opinion
on army lists has done a complete 180.

I honestly feel that we should allow a short "Grandfathering" period
after an FHE list booklet is published to allow players to transition
to the new list, then require that only the FHE list be used.

Many people probably wish FHE would be more open-minded to list
issues that multiple players try to address, but there is no doubt
that the lists are VERY balanced, and give players a good shot at
having a level playing field at the start of the game.

Some of the other published lists are just not balanced, and forget
small details like "Flaming pigs may only be used if the opposing
army may have elephants." The result makes a troop type that
basically operates completely outside of it's historical model. This
is only one example.

Another point on this is strictly from a marketing support
perspective. We have to try to buy FHE stuff to help the company. As
much as I have ranted on these guys, they did bring a great game to
the hobby, and the least we owe them is financial support.

The last point is application of lists to new players. We have been
recruiting quite a bit as of late, and these new players do not have
access to some of the older lists. This is just not fair, from my
perspective.

So, to my way of thinking, we should move to the new lists as soon as
it is practicle. The positives far outweigh the negatives.

Now, if only I could find a list with a list rule to only allow the
army to roll up!

g



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[joncleaves]

In a message dated 3/3/2004 3:22:26 PM Eastern Standard Time,
greg.regets@... writes:

> I honestly feel that we should allow a short "Grandfathering" period
> after an FHE list booklet is published to allow players to transition
> to the new list, then require that only the FHE list be used.>>

It is NASAMW policy to supercede old lists as soon as FHE books are out, not FHE
policy. Certainly FHE would prefer it, but at the end of the day the tourney
organizer is in charge. There is NO WAY FHE will ever presume to tell a
non-fifth horsemen event organizer how to run his event.

If the lads of Texas want to continue using old 6th ed lists for warrior even
after all our books are out - that is totally your perogative.

Greg does, however, correctly point out that 6th ed lists and warrior balance is
an issue, as is the rerality of us being a business that pays for the printing
of the next product with the proceeds of the last. New player access to old
lists is also an excellent point.

>
> Many people probably wish FHE would be more open-minded to list
> issues that multiple players try to address,>>

And we'd prefer certain players stopped confusing our disagreement with them
with close-mindedness....lol

I have often wondered if those that post, or even get/send emails at all, on
this group ever think about the opinions of the vast majority that don't post
but maintain a membership here. Then there are those players who aren't members
of this group at all but are avid Warrior players. We have a responsibility to
all of them as well, not just those that post frequently.

Jon

[joncleaves]

In a message dated 3/3/2004 3:29:34 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Harlan.D.Garrett@... writes:

> Correction
>
> Five books soon to be six. I forgot about New World
> Warrior.>>

Thanks, Harlan. That reminds me to bug Scott about where we are with our
Pacific Islander lists.....!

[Harlan Garrett]

Jon,

I was looking through the Book of Host and I noticed it had some armies I
have been meaning to paint: Tahitian, Hawaiian, Maori, and Fijian. Lets
not forget the ever popular: Forest League, Mississippi, North American, or
the Pacific Coast Native Americans. I am sure everyone wants to do an
Pacificer list. <<<wink, wink>>>

Harlan


-----Original Message-----
From: JonCleaves@... [mailto:JonCleaves@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 3:19 PM
To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


In a message dated 3/3/2004 3:29:34 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Harlan.D.Garrett@... writes:

> Correction
>
> Five books soon to be six. I forgot about New World
> Warrior.>>

Thanks, Harlan. That reminds me to bug Scott about where we are with our
Pacific Islander lists.....!



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[joncleaves]

In a message dated 3/3/2004 4:38:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Harlan.D.Garrett@... writes:

> Jon,
>
> I was looking through the Book of Host and I noticed it had some armies I
> have been meaning to paint: Tahitian, Hawaiian, Maori, and Fijian. Lets
> not forget the ever popular: Forest League, Mississippi, North American, or
> the Pacific Coast Native Americans. I am sure everyone
> wants to do an
> Pacificer list. <<<wink, wink>>>
>
> Harlan>>

Oh, we'll do them. It's just a matter of when. We have an initial draft and
when we do do them, they'll be out for free like NWW. Just not the highest
priority at the moment as I am sure you will understand.

J

[Harlan Garrett]

I absolutely understand, we will be happy whenever they show.

Harlan

-----Original Message-----
From: JonCleaves@... [mailto:JonCleaves@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 3:51 PM
To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


In a message dated 3/3/2004 4:38:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Harlan.D.Garrett@... writes:

> Jon,
>
> I was looking through the Book of Host and I noticed it had some
> armies I have been meaning to paint: Tahitian, Hawaiian, Maori, and
> Fijian. Lets not forget the ever popular: Forest League,
> Mississippi, North American, or the Pacific Coast Native Americans. I
> am sure everyone wants to do an Pacificer list. <<<wink, wink>>>
>
> Harlan>>

Oh, we'll do them. It's just a matter of when. We have an initial draft
and when we do do them, they'll be out for free like NWW. Just not the
highest priority at the moment as I am sure you will understand.

J


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[scott holder]

We have the draft of one list, Hawaian.

-----Original Message-----
From: JonCleaves@... [mailto:JonCleaves@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 3:51 PM
To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


In a message dated 3/3/2004 4:38:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Harlan.D.Garrett@... writes:

> Jon,
>
> I was looking through the Book of Host and I noticed it had some armies I
> have been meaning to paint: Tahitian, Hawaiian, Maori, and Fijian. Lets
> not forget the ever popular: Forest League, Mississippi, North American, or
> the Pacific Coast Native Americans. I am sure everyone
> wants to do an
> Pacificer list. <<<wink, wink>>>
>
> Harlan>>

Oh, we'll do them. It's just a matter of when. We have an initial draft and
when we do do them, they'll be out for free like NWW. Just not the highest
priority at the moment as I am sure you will understand.

J




Yahoo! Groups Links

[Harlan Garrett]

Wow,

-----Original Message-----
From: Holder, Scott [mailto:Scott.Holder@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 3:56 PM
To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


We have the draft of one list, Hawaian.

-----Original Message-----
From: JonCleaves@... [mailto:JonCleaves@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 3:51 PM
To: WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [WarriorRules] FHE Lists


In a message dated 3/3/2004 4:38:38 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Harlan.D.Garrett@... writes:

> Jon,
>
> I was looking through the Book of Host and I noticed it had some
> armies I have been meaning to paint: Tahitian, Hawaiian, Maori, and
> Fijian. Lets not forget the ever popular: Forest League,
> Mississippi, North American, or the Pacific Coast Native Americans. I
> am sure everyone wants to do an Pacificer list. <<<wink, wink>>>
>
> Harlan>>

Oh, we'll do them. It's just a matter of when. We have an initial draft
and when we do do them, they'll be out for free like NWW. Just not the
highest priority at the moment as I am sure you will understand.

J




Yahoo! Groups Links








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[joncleaves]

In a message dated 3/3/2004 4:56:23 PM Eastern Standard Time,
Scott.Holder@... writes:

> We have the draft of one list, Hawaian.>>

Pardon Scott, he is Mr Grumpy Gills today.

Harlan, et al
The Hawaiian list is an example of the type of exciting 'extra' projects we have
for the future when all the lists, Warrior Battles and the 2d printing are done.

There really isn't a limit to the ideas we will consider when our base products
are finally complete, but we already have a large number of things in the works
or thought up - Fantasy Warrior, Campaign Warrior, Fleet Warrior, Siege Warrior,
the
master army list book, lists like Hawaiian that don't quite fit in a list book,
Renaissance Warrior...plenty to do...lol
Jon

[Don Coon]

> Harlan ...
>
> Having served as the referee last weekend, I can say that my opinion
> on army lists has done a complete 180.
>
> I honestly feel that we should allow a short "Grandfathering" period
> after an FHE list booklet is published to allow players to transition
> to the new list, then require that only the FHE list be used.

A break through! I have been trying to get Harlan to embrace the FHE way of
allowing lists at tournies for some time. Perhaps with your 180, he will
make one as well.

Of course as Jon has said, one is free to runs ones Tournies any way they
see fit, I have always felt we should try to run them as much like the rest
of the world as possible. That is not to say I frown on themes or things of
that nature which can be quite fun.

Among all the reasons you cite, I have another. In order to qualify as a
Fifth Horseman event it must be run under a certain set of conditions, one
of which is FHE lists (where such a list exists - it is still ok to use old
lists when a FHE list is as of yet unpublished).

Don

[Greg Regets]

I certainly don't think there was anything nefarious in this decision
Don. I assure you, it was only a matter of practicality.

I played three tournaments with the old list before I could even
field the new list. Having needed this time myself, it seemed
hypocritical to tell other players they could not have the same
courtesy; not to mention not wanting to be exclusionary at a time
when we were doing our level best to recruit.

I do believe we are past that now. With two exceptions, San Antonio
players are all using FHE lists. Those exceptions are both Imperial
armies, so if the new lists are drastically different, we may need to
offer a bit of time to get figures together.

Nice to see you on the board again Don ... lets so something in DFW
some time soon. :-)

g


--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, <jjendon@c...> wrote:
> > Harlan ...
> >
> > Having served as the referee last weekend, I can say that my
opinion
> > on army lists has done a complete 180.
> >
> > I honestly feel that we should allow a short "Grandfathering"
period
> > after an FHE list booklet is published to allow players to
transition
> > to the new list, then require that only the FHE list be used.
>
> A break through! I have been trying to get Harlan to embrace the
FHE way of
> allowing lists at tournies for some time. Perhaps with your 180,
he will
> make one as well.
>
> Of course as Jon has said, one is free to runs ones Tournies any
way they
> see fit, I have always felt we should try to run them as much like
the rest
> of the world as possible. That is not to say I frown on themes or
things of
> that nature which can be quite fun.
>
> Among all the reasons you cite, I have another. In order to qualify
as a
> Fifth Horseman event it must be run under a certain set of
conditions, one
> of which is FHE lists (where such a list exists - it is still ok to
use old
> lists when a FHE list is as of yet unpublished).
>
> Don

[Don Coon]

No no, I never thought there was anything untoward going on. Heck I played
against your KoSJ and you were using a FHE list and I still got waxed .

Don


> I certainly don't think there was anything nefarious in this decision
> Don. I assure you, it was only a matter of practicality.

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Amen to that! As much as I like playing at Dave's, Speaking for Jack and myself,
the drive to Dallas is much easier on us!

kelly
Greg Regets <greg.regets@...> wrote:

Nice to see you on the board again Don ... lets so something in DFW
some time soon. :-)

g




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