Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[Mike Bard]

Being at least partially insane, and being amazed by the number of closet
Greeks on the list, I thought I'd through down the gauntlet.

Can we get enough people and figures to replay Platea at Cold Wars 2005?

As a rough estimate of figures (from the 1st ed WRG 'Armies of the Greek and
Persian Wars):

Greeks:
5000 Spartan Hoplites (Reg A HI LTS Sh): 100 Figures
35000 Other Hoplites (Reg C HI LTS Sh): 600 Figures
Lights: ? (Irreg C LI JLS, Sh? - say 200 Figures)

Persians:
10000 Immortals (Reg A HI JLS Sh OR B): 200 Figures
10000 Medes (Irreg C MI JLS Sh OR JLS B OR B, Sh): 200 Figures
11000 Other Infantry (LMI/LI JLS, B OR B): 220 Figures
10000 Cavalry (Irr D LC JLS, Reg A HC JLS B, Irreg LC B): 200 Figures
15000 Medizing Greeks (1/2 Reg D HI LTS Sh, 1/2 Reg C HI LTS Sh): 300
Figures
~1100 Persian Figures

(yes, 1000 Hoplite Figures)

So, can we get enough Greek players and figures together? Can we get enough
Persian players together? (Are there any lurking on the list?)

If there is enough interest we can hammer out the numbers in more detail. I
would guess that the table would have to be 12-16 feet in length and 5 feet
wide.

Michael Bard
That Insane Greek Hoplite Guy

[joncleaves]

In a message dated 3/24/2004 3:22:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, mwbard@...
writes:

> Can we get enough people and figures to replay Platea at
> Cold Wars 2005?>>

This is a great idea. As it takes off, let's talk about what FHE can do to
support it.

[Eric Turner]

Mike,
Everybody loves the Greeks but we just don't want it to be publicly
known.

Eric
A Barbarian just trying to be civilized.



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Bard" <mwbard@r...>
wrote:
> Being at least partially insane, and being amazed by the number of
closet
> Greeks on the list, I thought I'd through down the gauntlet.
>
> Can we get enough people and figures to replay Platea at Cold Wars
2005?
>
> As a rough estimate of figures (from the 1st ed WRG 'Armies of the
Greek and
> Persian Wars):
>
> Greeks:
> 5000 Spartan Hoplites (Reg A HI LTS Sh): 100 Figures
> 35000 Other Hoplites (Reg C HI LTS Sh): 600 Figures
> Lights: ? (Irreg C LI JLS, Sh? - say 200 Figures)
>
> Persians:
> 10000 Immortals (Reg A HI JLS Sh OR B): 200 Figures
> 10000 Medes (Irreg C MI JLS Sh OR JLS B OR B, Sh): 200 Figures
> 11000 Other Infantry (LMI/LI JLS, B OR B): 220 Figures
> 10000 Cavalry (Irr D LC JLS, Reg A HC JLS B, Irreg LC B): 200
Figures
> 15000 Medizing Greeks (1/2 Reg D HI LTS Sh, 1/2 Reg C HI LTS Sh):
300
> Figures
> ~1100 Persian Figures
>
> (yes, 1000 Hoplite Figures)
>
> So, can we get enough Greek players and figures together? Can we
get enough
> Persian players together? (Are there any lurking on the list?)
>
> If there is enough interest we can hammer out the numbers in more
detail. I
> would guess that the table would have to be 12-16 feet in length
and 5 feet
> wide.
>
> Michael Bard
> That Insane Greek Hoplite Guy

[Bill Chriss]

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Bard" <mwbard@r...>
wrote:
> Being at least partially insane, and being amazed by the number of
closet
> Greeks on the list, I thought I'd through down the gauntlet.
>
> Can we get enough people and figures to replay Platea at Cold Wars
2005?
>
>>
> (yes, 1000 Hoplite Figures)
>
> So, can we get enough Greek players and figures together? Can we
get enough
> Persian players together? (


I've got 60 and plan to paint up at least as many more. They
are "other" as in non-Spartan.




Greek

[Mike Bard]

The nice thing about redoing Platea is that the Spartan's hadn't yet adopted
the lambda as their shield symbol. Thus, other than having long hair and
all being dressed in red (which can be debated somewhat), they are no
different from any other hoplites.

Are there any Persians out there? Unfortunately if there are no Persian
players then this isn't going to work and we're going to have to settle for
something like Mantinea (Sparta+Allies vs.Argives+Allies) but there are only
about 10,000 hoplites a side (200 figures per side).

Michael Bard
That Greek Hoplite Guy

> > So, can we get enough Greek players and figures together? Can we
> get enough
> > Persian players together? (
>
>
> I've got 60 and plan to paint up at least as many more. They
> are "other" as in non-Spartan.

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "hrisikos8" <hrisikos@D...>
wrote:
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Bard" <mwbard@r...>
> wrote:
> > Being at least partially insane, and being amazed by the number
of
> closet
> > Greeks on the list, I thought I'd through down the gauntlet.
> >
> > Can we get enough people and figures to replay Platea at Cold
Wars
> 2005?
> >
> >>
> > (yes, 1000 Hoplite Figures)
> >
> > So, can we get enough Greek players and figures together? Can
we
> get enough
> > Persian players together? (
>

I have 33 stands painted atm, which is 132 Hoplites.

Shan

[Bill Chriss]

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Bard" <mwbard@r...>
wrote:
> The nice thing about redoing Platea is that the Spartan's hadn't
yet adopted
> the lambda as their shield symbol. Thus, other than having long
hair and
> all being dressed in red (which can be debated somewhat), they are
no
> different from any other hoplites.
>


Fascinating. What's the source for the advent of the Lambda? As for
red, it would be more accurate, I think, to call it crimson (rose
madder). Kind of like the difference between the reds of Oklahoma
and Nebraska.



we're going to have to settle for
> something like Mantinea (Sparta+Allies vs.Argives+Allies) but
there are only
> about 10,000 hoplites a side (200 figures per side).
>



This would be great, but do you refer to the Mantinea of 364? If so,
I though Epaminondas the Theban, not an Argive, was in command of
the allied army.



Greek

[Mike Bard]

> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Bard" <mwbard@r...>
> wrote:
> > The nice thing about redoing Platea is that the Spartan's hadn't
> yet adopted
> > the lambda as their shield symbol. Thus, other than having long
> hair and
> > all being dressed in red (which can be debated somewhat), they are
> no
> > different from any other hoplites.
>
> Fascinating. What's the source for the advent of the Lambda? As for
> red, it would be more accurate, I think, to call it crimson (rose
> madder). Kind of like the difference between the reds of Oklahoma
> and Nebraska.
>
The only reference I've fond so far is in 'The Spartan Army' (Osprey
Publishing, Nick Sekunda). Using the references given on pages 27-28,
Plutarch states that one Lakonian had a life-size fly as his shield emblem.
In the Lexicon of Photium, under the entry for the letter lambda, it is
stated that Lakedaimonians painted this letter on their shields. Pontius
gives the Athenian comic poet Eupolis as his source. Eupolis likely died
at the battle of Kynossema in 411 and his last play was performed in 412
which gives 412 as the latest date for the adoption of the lambda symbol..
'The Spartan Army' estimates the date of the adoption of a common shield
design as sometime between 475 and 450 BC.

And yes, I should have said crimson but I have a nasty habit of painting
them as red with dark washes to make it crimson, so I think of it as red.

> we're going to have to settle for
> > something like Mantinea (Sparta+Allies vs.Argives+Allies) but
> there are only
> > about 10,000 hoplites a side (200 figures per side).
> >
> This would be great, but do you refer to the Mantinea of 364? If so,
> I though Epaminondas the Theban, not an Argive, was in command of
> the allied army.

The Mantinea I was thinking of was in 418 when Alkibiades formed an alliance
of cities against Sparta during the Peace of Nikias.

Michael Bard
That Greek Hoplite Guy

[Ed Kollmer]

I have about 90 Hoplites mostly of the "other" city states.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Bard" <mwbard@...>
To: <WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 7:46 PM
Subject: Re: [WarriorRules] Re: Replaying Platea


> > --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Bard" <mwbard@r...>
> > wrote:
> > > The nice thing about redoing Platea is that the Spartan's hadn't
> > yet adopted
> > > the lambda as their shield symbol. Thus, other than having long
> > hair and
> > > all being dressed in red (which can be debated somewhat), they are
> > no
> > > different from any other hoplites.
> >
> > Fascinating. What's the source for the advent of the Lambda? As for
> > red, it would be more accurate, I think, to call it crimson (rose
> > madder). Kind of like the difference between the reds of Oklahoma
> > and Nebraska.
> >
> The only reference I've fond so far is in 'The Spartan Army' (Osprey
> Publishing, Nick Sekunda). Using the references given on pages 27-28,
> Plutarch states that one Lakonian had a life-size fly as his shield
emblem.
> In the Lexicon of Photium, under the entry for the letter lambda, it is
> stated that Lakedaimonians painted this letter on their shields. Pontius
> gives the Athenian comic poet Eupolis as his source. Eupolis likely
died
> at the battle of Kynossema in 411 and his last play was performed in 412
> which gives 412 as the latest date for the adoption of the lambda symbol..
> 'The Spartan Army' estimates the date of the adoption of a common shield
> design as sometime between 475 and 450 BC.
>
> And yes, I should have said crimson but I have a nasty habit of painting
> them as red with dark washes to make it crimson, so I think of it as red.
>
> > we're going to have to settle for
> > > something like Mantinea (Sparta+Allies vs.Argives+Allies) but
> > there are only
> > > about 10,000 hoplites a side (200 figures per side).
> > >
> > This would be great, but do you refer to the Mantinea of 364? If so,
> > I though Epaminondas the Theban, not an Argive, was in command of
> > the allied army.
>
> The Mantinea I was thinking of was in 418 when Alkibiades formed an
alliance
> of cities against Sparta during the Peace of Nikias.
>
> Michael Bard
> That Greek Hoplite Guy
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

Should I assume this is in 25mm, not 15mm? I have many Greeks and Persians
in 15mm.



Fred Stratton







Being at least partially insane, and being amazed by the number of closet

Greeks on the list, I thought I'd through down the gauntlet.



Can we get enough people and figures to replay Platea at Cold Wars 2005?



As a rough estimate of figures (from the 1st ed WRG 'Armies of the Greek and

Persian Wars):



Greeks:

5000 Spartan Hoplites (Reg A HI LTS Sh): 100 Figures

35000 Other Hoplites (Reg C HI LTS Sh): 600 Figures

Lights: ? (Irreg C LI JLS, Sh? - say 200 Figures)



Persians:

10000 Immortals (Reg A HI JLS Sh OR B): 200 Figures

10000 Medes (Irreg C MI JLS Sh OR JLS B OR B, Sh): 200 Figures

11000 Other Infantry (LMI/LI JLS, B OR B): 220 Figures

10000 Cavalry (Irr D LC JLS, Reg A HC JLS B, Irreg LC B): 200 Figures

15000 Medizing Greeks (1/2 Reg D HI LTS Sh, 1/2 Reg C HI LTS Sh): 300

Figures

~1100 Persian Figures



(yes, 1000 Hoplite Figures)



So, can we get enough Greek players and figures together? Can we get enough

Persian players together? (Are there any lurking on the list?)



If there is enough interest we can hammer out the numbers in more detail. I

would guess that the table would have to be 12-16 feet in length and 5 feet

wide.



Michael Bard

That Insane Greek Hoplite Guy









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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bill Chriss]

do you refer to the Mantinea of 364? If so,
> > I though Epaminondas the Theban, not an Argive, was in command of
> > the allied army.
>
> The Mantinea I was thinking of was in 418 when Alkibiades formed
an alliance
> of cities against Sparta during the Peace of Nikias.
>
> Michael Bard
> That Greek Hoplite Guy


Still, a very cool idea. Anything could happen with ole' Alkibiades.
He might even change sides as CinC!!! I've got mostly Argives and
Arcadians I built for trhe old NASAMW list. They're all 15's though.


Greek

[Mike Bard]

I was planning for it to be in 25mm for the visual impact (and I only have
Greeks in 25mm). However, if there are only 15mm Persians, then it may have
to be rethought.

Does anybody have any 25mm Persians? (getting a bit desperate here...) If
not, we can always do the first battle of Matinea with roughly 10,000
hoplites a side (we can reduce the figure ratio to put more hoplites on the
field if necessary).

Michael Bard
That Greek Hoplite Guy


> Should I assume this is in 25mm, not 15mm? I have many Greeks and
Persians
> in 15mm.

[Chris Bump]

In a message dated 3/25/2004 7:54:06 AM Central Standard Time,
Scott.Holder@... writes:
>I have 72 hoplites. Persians are gonna be the tough part in all of this,
particularly in 25mm. I have a few generic odds and ends that could work for
some things but they don't look great and couldn't be considered even a core of
starting an army.
Appears to me that 820 Persians in 25 need to be painted in less than a year
or another battle needs to be selected. I often read in WI how the various
clubs over in Britain pull together for their demo games and paint up the
necessary figs.

I will volunteer to paint figures for this effort. I imagine that there are
others in this group who could be convinced to paint a unit or two towards
this effort. Get enough volunteers and the army can be completed in short
order.
So all we need is a philanthrapist who wants to purchase some 800 Persian
figures or someone who has the lead in a box and needs it painted? =8^)

Chris


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[scott holder]

Should I assume this is in 25mm, not 15mm? I have many Greeks and Persians in
15mm.

>Hopefully in 25mm! Makes for a better display plus you should see Mike and
crew's hoplites.

>I have 72 hoplites. Persians are gonna be the tough part in all of this,
particularly in 25mm. I have a few generic odds and ends that could work for
some things but they don't look great and couldn't be considered even a core of
starting an army.

scott

[Mike Bard]

I may have found somebody with 300 Persian foot and 100 Persian cavalry.
More information as it unfolds.

Anyway, as it stands now Greeks aren't the problem. At this point I'll take
anything that is vaguely Persian, particularly cavalry. the Persians have
Scythian cavalry, Thessalian medizing cavalry, near east skirmishers, and
Persians. Some figures from Seleucid armies (for example) could be used.

Note that I don't mind painting some figures, and hopefully others won't
either, but there is pretty well no way that I could paint 800 hoplites and
500 persians by next March.

Michael Bard
That Greek Hoplite Guy

> Should I assume this is in 25mm, not 15mm? I have many Greeks and
Persians in 15mm.
>
> >Hopefully in 25mm! Makes for a better display plus you should see Mike
and crew's hoplites.
>
> >I have 72 hoplites. Persians are gonna be the tough part in all of this,
particularly in 25mm. I have a few generic odds and ends that could work
for some things but they don't look great and couldn't be considered even a
core of starting an army.