Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[Greg]

Perhaps this has been discussed at length, but has there ever been any consideration to having minimum unit sizes as part of the army list, instead of the universal "two stands?"

This would do a lot to keep troop types in historically sized groupings.

Just a thought ...

[joncleaves]

We would take some suggestions with support .

Jon

[Greg]

This was more of a general question ... "Is it worth even discussing?" rather than anything specific.

If a few examples are needed though:

Moogs - seems like the common thing is to buy them in three stand units, when at least for Roger de Flor's mercenary hoard, it's pretty clear that what the Byzantines paid for was a big block of around 1,500 cavalry and around 4,000 infantry in three big blocks.

Early-ish Saxons - What I've been seeing with these, is guys playing them in two stand units and pretending they are Roman Legionaries. Reasonably effective if you use them well.

EIR - I don't think I've ever seen anyone take that oversized first Cohort.

Again, just a discussion point, not a "problem." Any rule we all play by, is a good rule.

[Frank Gilson]

Well, I'll take a stab at sizes, and reasoning, from an army size and point total basis.

First off, you want an army with 'enough' units in it to properly oppose enemy armies. Too few units and you can't properly protect flanks, and risk a large unit being 'tied up' by one small, cheap enemy unit.

Too many units and individually they're very vulnerable to shooting and hand to hand, a rout will cause a lot of waver tests and potential damage to your army. Also, lots of units means that you have a lot of points tied up in command factors, especially with irregulars.

I like to have 'roughly' 1 unit per 100 points that I'm playing with. If I have regulars in my army, then two to four more units than that is appropriate given the cheaper cost of reg command factors.

So, on 1600 points, 16 to 20 units is a good guide. How does this influence unit size?

Well, it means my average unit should cost a little under 100 points.

If I want about 18 units, then my shock units (or 'bigger'/more important units) can cost about 140 points each while my smaller/skirmishing units can cost about 40 points each (these are averages, some fiddling around is certainly possible.)

I could go as high as 9 shock/large units and 9 skirmish/small units for such an army with this arrangement.

(Note that a large unit could be a block of archers or spearmen instead of a units of knights or elephants)

If I spend about 140 points on a large unit, what do I get? How many elements is this?

It's two elements of a units of SHK. It's eight elements of a unit of pikemen (Reg C MI). It's three elephants (only two with LI on base and extra crew.)

What about my skirmish/small units? 40 points isn't much.

That's two elements of Reg B LC B. Eight elements of Irr D LI B. 4 elements of Reg C LI S,Sh.

You can see how a desire to have the right number of units, on a point total, and what certain units costs influences number of elements per unit.