Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[christiangcameron]

Hello--Long time away!

This has never come up, despite years of use--but I'm anxious lest it not come up in the middle of a Biblical game at CWs.

Let us say that I have a general in a LCh who forms a unit with 2 Lchs (so a 3E unit).

Let's say they dismount (nothing more historical, at least for Mycenaeans!) as a single element. Can they now join a unit?

If yes (an assumption that may prove unwarranted), and they join an irr. infantry unit of 9 elements, does the general' element go in the center of the front rank?

If so, under what circumstances can the general revert to his chariot and move away? Can he, for instance, leave the infantry during staff moves? Can he then mount, becoming a unit and does this thus end his staff move? If the infantry unit is only 2E wide, can he mount to form a 3E deep column resting on the flank of the inf and facing the same way? On approaches? On staff moves?

In a 12E unit of chariots dismounts to form a 4E unit of HI, where inside the original block does the resulting and immensely smaller block go?

If a chariot general (no other elements, just the general's) joins a unit (I'm thinking of Achilles with the Myrmidons) is that unit now bound by the terrain rules in regards to chariots? And are opponents still bound by the chariot within cause of unease? (Both would seem odd as LChs could be carried by charioteers and would seem to offer very little threat from so far in the rear, but a rule is a rule)

Thanks. As I re-read this, I realize that it seems like a great many questions--I see them all as related, but I', sorry--and I have more! (All related to the 3:1 dismount rule).

Chris Cameron

[joncleaves]

Such a general cannot join a unit. He is not part of an independent staff element (2.513) - although it may *look* like he is one while dismounted, he's still part of a (temporarily one element) unit.

How the unit looks dismounted is covered by this from 6.61:

"When dismounting, the front rank of the dismounted
unit is matched to the position of the front rank of the
mounted version. If they differ in size, as many elements
of front rank the dismounted unit must match up to the
positions of the mounted version's front rank as possible."

As far as the Chariot general joining the foot unit, see 4.13:

"When a mounted general joins a unit on foot, his staff
element is placed behind (NOT IN) the rear rank. The
general is then assumed to be in the front rank of the foot
for eagerness (5.11), random factor dicing (9.43), and risk to
him (10.4), but neither his own figure or others of his staff
element count as fighting except for calculating CPF
received (10.3). The staff element cannot be placed
anywhere but behind the actual rear rank and does not count
as a rank for any purpose except CPF received."

Terrain and the chariots is handled on an element by element basis - part of the foot unit could be in terrain, but the chariot element could not enter it.

Jon

[Frank Gilson]

So there is no way for a 1E chariot general to dismount...that's forbidden, and therefore, given your clarification here, no way for any chariot general to dismount as an element and join a foot body to be a foot general?

Your clarification for terrain regarding a Chariot general staff joined to some other body runs afoul of:
"All movement restrictions that apply to either body apply to both."

That, from the end of 4.13, would suggest that if a chariot staff element joins another body, the ENTIRE body cannot enter any terrain.

Frank

[christiangcameron]

Thanks, Jon. That simplifies my life.

I

[joncleaves]

Actually, Frank, the rule is:

"• Rough areas are impassable to wheels."

Not something like: rough areas are impassable to an entire body even if only one element contains wheels.

See also the mixed bodies rule in 12.3:

MIXED BODIES: For bodies that consist of elements of
different types, consider the effects of the terrain on the
body on an element by element basis. For example, a body
consisting of both LI and El is only disordered by a rough
area if any part of the El elements are ‘in’ that feature.
An edge or face of an element or body aligned exactly with
the edge of a terrain feature is ‘in’ that feature.

What 4.13 says is:

When a mounted general joins a unit on foot, his staff
element is placed behind (NOT IN) the rear rank. The
general is then assumed to be in the front rank of the foot
for eagerness (5.11), random factor dicing (9.43), and risk to
him (10.4), but neither his own figure or others of his staff
element count as fighting except for calculating CPF
received (10.3). The staff element cannot be placed
anywhere but behind the actual rear rank and does not count
as a rank for any purpose except CPF received.

It does not make an exception for movement, so for movement, the chariot element is where the chariot element is.

[Frank Gilson]

Thanks!