Warrior Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules
A Four Horsemen Enterprises Rules Set
 
  FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups AlbumAlbum   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Terrors From the Steppes--Hcon 10 Theme
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules Forum Index -> Events
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
scott holder
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 6032
Location: Bonnots Mill, MO

PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 6:17 pm    Post subject: Terrors From the Steppes--Hcon 10 Theme

Here be the lists but not all restrictions listed; expect some, suggestions welcome on restrictions, particularly Mongols. I really don't want this to be the Mongol Civil War Tournament.

Classical Warrior
2) Skythian


Imperial Warrior
4) Early Rhoxolani Sarmatian
5) Siracae/Iazyges Sarmatian


Dark Age Warrior
17) Khazar


Holy Warrior
26) Islamic Persian
30) Khwarizmian


Feudal Warrior
23) Post-Mongol Russian

Oriental Warrior
10) Xiongnu
12) Kushan
13) Early Turk
14) Xianbei
21) Tibetan/Tangut
24) Uighur Turk
28) Jurchen, Jin Dynasty Chinese
29) Khitan Liao
33) Qarakhitan
35) Mongol
37) Golden Horde
38) Ilkhanid
44) Timurid

Tentative X-Rules will be 5.11 (Reg B eagerness), 6.11 (Close Order Foot Tac move), 6.2 (Close Order Foot Marching), 6.45 (EHC Skirmishing), 17.1 (SHC/SHCm Cost)

_________________
These Rules Suck, Let's Paint!


Last edited by scott holder on Mon Mar 15, 2010 8:00 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   Visit poster's website
Ewan McNay
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 2769
Location: Albany, NY, US

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 3:58 pm    Post subject:

I think that Mongol civil war is relatively unlikely - see for instance my Hun experiment in the last LC-themed tournament: Mongols have trouble against cheap massed LC, which several lists here have.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Mark Stone
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 2102
Location: Buckley, WA

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 7:31 am    Post subject:

Also, people should look closely at which lists get both camels and camel-proof cav, light camels and camel-proof light cav especially. There are some interesting tactics you can play with attempting to disorder your opponent's screen with the camels, and then shoot into a second cause of disorder on prep (or simply run him over because he doesn't fight as well disordered). Some lists can get camel-mounted infantry, which provides another interesting angle on this set of tactics.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   MSN Messenger
scott holder
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 6032
Location: Bonnots Mill, MO

PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:27 pm    Post subject:

You mean the much maligned LCm troop type might, just might have a function in this tournament?

There's a first for everything. Laughing

scott

_________________
These Rules Suck, Let's Paint!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   Visit poster's website
Todd Kaeser
Centurion
Centurion


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1211
Location: Foxborough, Massachusetts

PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 3:02 am    Post subject:

Are you two stealing some thunder from one of the lists I'm working on Cool
_________________
Nolite te Bastardes Carborundorum
"Don't let the Bastards Grind You Down"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ]
Frank Gilson
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1553
Location: Orange County California

PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 4:05 am    Post subject: mongols

I don't expect Mongols to do too well, as Ewan states, facing twice their number in mounted archers...flanks collapsing, etc.

There are also Irr SHC, which will likely be receiving the benefit of the X-Rule discount, to consider (which Mongols don't get).

In fact, if you're reading this and thinking about Mongols, you should take primarily loose order and just dismount in between two terrain features (or the corner)...pay for pavise!

Frank
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Terry D
Recruit
Recruit


Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 6:34 pm    Post subject:

Most of the theme armies seem to have the ability to have camel proof cav, where as El proofing is rarer. That provides for some interesting options with the later Kushan list. You have access to both camels and decent El. Added bonus a cause of unease that most theme armies don't have.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Ewan McNay
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 2769
Location: Albany, NY, US

PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:48 pm    Post subject:

The only downside to El will be that almost all of the opposing cav are bow-armed; even disordered H/MC can shoot up El and then run away..
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Terry D
Recruit
Recruit


Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 7:56 pm    Post subject:

The main effect of the El is to disorder and cause test and fail those tests. A lot can be done with this army you have El, cam, 1.5 LC you can have decent LMI. All of the various lists seem to have some combination of the above traits Kushan has the most variety.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Frank Gilson
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1553
Location: Orange County California

PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 9:25 pm    Post subject: SHC camel proof?

Scott,

On the Xiongnu and Kushan lists, loose order cav can be upgraded to camel proof...but what happens when you upgrade those to SHC? There is no current provision to make the SHC camel proof...so you end up with 3 camel proof figures and 1 non-camel proof...hmmm.

I think the camel proofing line should be moved to the end of these lists and include SHC.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Terry D
Recruit
Recruit


Joined: 18 Jul 2008
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 1:24 am    Post subject:

Frank the SHC on the Kushan list are specifically excluded from camel proofing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Frank Gilson
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1553
Location: Orange County California

PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 5:50 pm    Post subject: aha

Terry D wrote:
Frank the SHC on the Kushan list are specifically excluded from camel proofing


Got it...I see the note now.

Then a similar note should probably be in the Xiongnu list.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Frank Gilson
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1553
Location: Orange County California

PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Terrors From the Steppes--Hcon 10 Theme

My vague 'list viability' notes interspersed below.

scott holder wrote:

Classical Warrior
2) Skythian


Skythian are viable but not because of the 'standard' cavalry, but rather the available infantry including hoplites and peltasts...and don't forget the superb Thracian foot unit and its anti-elephant promise.

scott holder wrote:

Imperial Warrior
4) Early Rhoxolani Sarmatian
5) Siracae/Iazyges Sarmatian


Move along please, nothing to see here. Seriously...the troop types available on these lists are better represented on more flexible other lists and often eclipsed by camels, etc.

scott holder wrote:

Dark Age Warrior
17) Khazar


Mostly the same problem...you can get some infantry but it pales in comparison to that available on other lists...and the mounted don't distinguish themselves from their more capable counterparts elsewhere.

scott holder wrote:

Holy Warrior
26) Islamic Persian
30) Khwarizmian


Don't use these either Wink...similar problems.

scott holder wrote:

Feudal Warrior
23) Post-Mongol Russian


I know Mark Stone has a fondness for Post-Mongol Russian, but its time is past given the nature of the lists in Oriental Warrior.

scott holder wrote:

Oriental Warrior
10) Xiongnu
12) Kushan
13) Early Turk
14) Xianbei
21) Tibetan/Tangut
24) Uighur Turk
2Cool Jurchen, Jin Dynasty Chinese
29) Khitan Liao
33) Qarakhitan
35) Mongol
37) Golden Horde
3Cool Ilkhanid
44) Timurid


Of these, I believe that the best are Kushan, Tibetan, Uighur Turk, Ilkhanid and Timurid...

Frank
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Ewan McNay
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 2769
Location: Albany, NY, US

PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:49 pm    Post subject:

Timurid is an option? Cool Smile.

[Suffers from lack of elephant-proofing, of course, but still has great infantry in theme, elephants, and mongol cav. Will be very small compared to some other armies and may have a problem with that.]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Mark Stone
Moderator
Moderator


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 2102
Location: Buckley, WA

PostPosted: Fri Feb 26, 2010 10:21 pm    Post subject:

Play Timurids as a counter-punching army. Get some terrain features you can set up between, rely on the fact that you have good rough terrain infantry when most in-theme do not, and expand out from this protected position to attack as your opponent comes to grips with you.

Other Mongol armies can't really play it this way. They lack the hard-hitting cav (SHC), the cavalry-disrupting shock troops (elephants), and the gimmicks (incendiary camel carts).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules Forum Index -> Events All times are GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group