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Cold Wars 2016 Results and AAR
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scott holder
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 6:42 pm    Post subject: Cold Wars 2016 Results and AAR

First, a grumpy point by me: I deleted a post asking about this. I'd appreciate it if non-attendees keep their proverbial shirts on until I make the first post with results. I only have to cover 940 miles on Sunday without getting speeding tickets (or shot, I drove by this: http://www.wgal.com/news/police-incident-closes-turnpike-interchange-in-fulton-county/38605118?utm_campaign=WGAL&utm_content=56eecc8904d30103208ae7f4&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=trueAnthem%3A+New+Content literally as it happened), then get into work and catch up on 2-3 days of emails and calls, then take some time to put together the results.

Dogs of War Mini

1) Todd Kaeser, Parthian, 13
2) Sean Scott, Communal Italian, 11
3) Don Carter, Indian, 10
4) Mike Mallamaci, Nikephorian Byzantine, 8
5) Dan Woyke, Neo-Babylonian, 7
6) Bill Low, Early Burgundian, 6
7) Frank Gilson, 10 Independent States, 6
8) Fred Stratton, Neo-Assyrian, 5
9) Chris Schulitz, Early Teutonic Order, 3
10) Greg Hauser, Bahmani Sultinate, 3
11) Tom Barkus, Patrician Roman, 2
12) Rich Kroupa, Hunnic, 2

I didn't use the spreadsheet so did tie-breakers the old fashioned way (opponent's record)

Doubles

1) Rich Kroupa and Ewan McNay, Kushan, 15/28.5
2) Todd Kaeser and Rob Turnball, Kanem-Bornu, 12/25
3) Greg Hauser and Chris Schulitz, Yuan Dynasty Chinese, 11/22.5
4) Bill Low and Dave Markowitz, Mithridatic, 11/20.5
5) Dave Stier and Frank Gilson, Early Teutonic Order, 11/18.9
6) Dan Woyke and Matt Kollmer, Incan, 8/16.8
7) Scott McDonald and Mike Kelly, Feudal Spanish, 8/15
8) Marc Cribbs and Jim Bisigani, EIR, 9/14.6
9) Mike Mallamaci and Fred Stratton, Neo-Assyrian, 5/9.2
10) Sean Scott and Jevon Garrett, Alexandrian Macedonian, 4/7.8

Sportsman: Mike Mallamaci. Other nominees: Rich Kroupa, Greg Hauser, Fred Stratton

Best Camp: Greg Hauser (Yuan)

Of note: There's a new Essex distributor in the US, Bob Rossi, located in northern VA. I handed out business cards. He's been very supportive of the ADLG guys and has extended that to us--I just didn't go that route this time. If somebody who got a card could post the pertinent data here, that would be great.

More later in a seperate post.

scott

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Ed Kollmer
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 2:02 am    Post subject:

Mea Culpa
Mea Culpa
Mea maxima Culpa

Sorry Scott
Forgive my grumpy impatience.
Sad
Embarassed
Ed Kollmer
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:17 pm    Post subject: Thanks to all

First off, huge thanks to Bill Low for making these events much more possible for all of us than they otherwise would be with all the travel assistance, armies and his very presence.

Thanks also to Scott Holder for all he does...including two long drives.

Now on to the AARs...first the Mini Dogs of War (1200 pts, 45% D morale):
I ran 10 Independent States, a Chinese spear/bow army.
CinC PA Reg A EHC/HC L,B,Sh/L,B
2 units of 8E Irr D MI LTS,B,Sh/LTS,B
6E Reg D(1 C) MI LTS,B,Sh/LTS,B
6E Reg D MI LTS,B,Sh/LTS,B
6E Reg D(1 C) LHI(2)/LMI(6) JLS,Sh/JLS
6E Reg D LMI B,Sh/B
3 units of 2E Reg D LI B
2 units of 2E Irr C El B/B/B
2 units of 4E Reg D(1 C) HI(1)/MI(3) LTS,Sh/LTS 1 firelance shot

Game 1 on Friday I play Tom Barkus. He is running Patrician Roman.
Tom does force my CinC to go handle a flank marching 2E LC unit, which makes my prompting units awkward (ultimately an elephant unit of mine only gets to charge on the other flank because Tom won a fight and his follow-up made it possible for my elephant to edge just behind the flank of that unit).

The key conflict occurs when his 9E legion of D morale MI JLS,D,Sh/"/B charges a 8E LTS/B unit of mine. I think he got a down one, while I rolled +3 (+2 for Ds)...routing him at contact...causing 3 wavers.

My elephant flank charge on his left helped cause a rout there, and 2-3 wavers. Enough of these wavers were failed to hand me a 4-1 victory, but not enough for a 5.

Tom played well, the matchup was not favorable to him...his flank march almost worked (and did cause me significant trouble).


Round 2 I faced Bill Low with Early Burgundian and a horde of 4E longbow units, 1/2 2HCW,Sh with stakes.

This is an iffy matchup for me as I can't catch anything, and Bill can certainly prompt retirements as needed. I also have to be careful about the amount of shooting he lines up on me and shadow knights with my elephants.

On the other hand, my plan is to force his loose foot into skirmish and then use elephants and CinC to cause wavers with long range charges, which Ds would hopefully fail, then fail following charges by my foot, routing and causing cascading wavers...the plan at least.

Well, the plan was derailed by an up 3 shooting die throw by Bill into one of my 8E units...disordering and halting it!

This causes me something of a traffic jam AND makes me have to get troops out of the way for the likely rout of that spear/bow unit...said units now not attacking Bill.

Bill sends in longbowmen to attack my halted unit...but doesn't rout it, and I pass a couple of wavers over bounds for recoiling disordered while disordered (somehow).

I blasted a LI unit into oblivion or cause a failed waver...and we draw 1-1. My own fault for not being properly prepared and in better position to handle receiving a large shooting plus.

A large woods with two of my units in it and my other spear/bow and elephants kept his knights from being able to add-in or attack anything else...so Bill wasn't able to get more points than I think one shaken unit.


Round 3 I play against Dan Woyke with Neo-Babylonians. He has an army that will be hard to get to grips, largely skirmishers with a couple of mounted units and some chariots. Dan sets up and has 15 scouting points missing. I'm tired and mistakenly think that's 5E of LC...I totally miss him rolling for the character of a Sub-Gen.

Yup, he has sent a three unit command on flank march down the obvious flank. I don't properly guard against this thinking it's just a LC unit so my CinC will charge it off the table.

We're screwing around elsewhere...I'm trying to force skirmishers into skirmish and then charge with elephants. Dan makes several counters and wavers with D class, sigh.

The flank march arrives and I'm surprised...I turn a couple of small units around to help deal with it but am having a lot of trouble with a weird hill that has various snaky steep and not steep alleys over it.

Dan gets a +1 die roll in long range shooting on my CinC...disordering me even though I'm up hill (-1 to shooting). Ok...so his LC can charge me impetuously...alright, I should still win and cause him to break off off the table.

Nope, he's Skythians and fights 1.5 ranks and dices a +2 in hth...and I don't dice up (which would have won it for me anyway). I recoil disordered.

He eventually gets my CinC...good flank march tactic with some die roll luck on his part...394 pts killed by him, 146 by me, 4-1 Dan.

10IS in this case suffered from inability to catch the primarily skirmishing armies I fought in two matchups, and a prompt point problem (particularly for the elephants, who do not get a free charge under attack orders). Another general would be...expensive under 1200 points Dogs format. Still, better play from me would have resulted in a somewhat better result.

Next post...Teams.

Frank
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 3:55 pm    Post subject: Teams with Dave Stier

Dave and I decided we did not want to run a 'killer' army, particularly one that we had run in the past...nor did we want to run an army that others had been running.

With the updates to Feudal Warrior, we thought we'd give Early Teutonic a try given the improvements in light troops. It would also allow us to run some 'Barbarian' blobs and try those guys out too.

List
CinC w/PA Reg A/B SHK/EHK L,Sh
Sub similar
Sub wP 1E Reg A SHK L,Sh
2E Reg B HC L,Sh
3 artillery each 3 crew (2 Hvy bolt shooters, 1 stone thrower)
2 units of 6E Irr C LC B (removed JLS,Sh, upgraded morale)
2 units of 6E Irr D LI JLS,Sh
8E Irr D LI B
3 units of 2E Irr A/B SHK/EHK L,Sh
2 units of 2E Reg A SHK/EHK L,Sh
4 units of 10E Irr C(2)/D(Cool LMI 2HCW,JLS,Sh(2)/JLS,Sh(2)/JLS(4)/B,Sh(2)
12E Irr C(2)/D(10) LMI 2HCW,JLS,Sh(2)/JLS,Sh(2)/JLS(6)/B,Sh(2)

Some Irr A SHK mixed with Regular knights give a good balance between maneuver and hitting really hard.

The Prussian foot are certainly brittle...but also hit very hard and can be shepherded by the CinC with army standard as well as occupy terrain. They're designed to operate 2 wide, 5 deep. The bow can shoot over up to 4 ranks and thus pull shooting to the unit away from our other troops.

Unfortunately I was mistaken about a rule (skirmishing)...even though the Prussian foot can only shoot from the front two ranks in skirmish, any body in skirmish is treated as the most vulnerable type anywhere in it as its target type...so skirmishing shieldless LMI in this case (whereas I thought they would count as shielded). Still, skirmishing was useful to them in various cases.

Matchups:
Game 1 against Fred Stratton and Mike Mallamaci with Neo-Assyrian
Fred and Mike run an army that is primarily Reg B and entirely able to skirmish with darts and bows. So it counters, wavers and evades readily.

We have an ambushing Prussian unit on a wooded hill on our left, supported by a knight unit (important later). Fred/Mike 'win' the die roll for initiative and have to approach first. They can't keep the 6E Reg B LMI JLS,D,Sh unit facing our woods in skirmish as it has nothing it knows it could shoot at. On our move we reveal the hidden Prussians and move up to charge range on that Assyrian unit.

Dave dices a plus in combat and Mike does not, and our 85-ish point Prussian foot unit routs the 154 point Assyrian unit, causing several wavers (all passed by high morale troops).

Later on, that Prussian foot unit is destroyed in place by a couple of charging HC L,B units, including a Sub General. One unit charged through their own routers to replace entire said routing unit in combat so our Prussian foot would do no casualties to shieldless mediums. We take no wavers as our unit is far enough forward and annihilated (shieldless mediums).

That renders two HC L,B units as disordered must rally...and Dave takes the supporting knight unit into the Assyrian sub general very late in the game, routing it and causing many wavers...several of which are failed (and I believe the command goes into retreat). That's the majority of our 5 point victory.

Elsewhere we do rout another foot unit, causing wavers...but Assyrian support is properly in place and also charges through that routing unit, getting a kill on one of our regular knight units...ensuing wavers do give Fred and Mike some points, but not enough.

Our dice hold generally well overall in this battle with a couple of crucial up rolls and reasonable wavers. Fred and Mike's held well until the end with the Sub's rout.


Game 2 against Greg Hauser and Chris Schulitz with Yuan. We were a little surprised to fight them as I think they had 3 points in their first game, so a pairing down?

They have more scouting but not double...but win the various die rolls for table side choice and command placement. We end up with most of our 'meat' facing 'airy' table (LC/LI) on our right flank, while Yuan artillery rules the center and we have a lightly held very rough Vineyard with LI and LMI in it holding our left flank.

Dave is pushing-pushing-pushing but Greg isn't giving him a fight (countering, evading).

I'm holding under Wait orders on the left and hoping to shoot at something with my artillery.

We end up having to take some shots from bow plus artillery with a Prussian unit. Greg and Chris have some fairly poor shooting results with some -2 and -1 rolls. Still, we end up losing that Prussian unit (but it's far forward enough such that we don't have to take and I think fail only one waver, if any).

We do, in the center, shoot up a LC unit with my artillery plus one of our LC units, rendering it disordered and tired. Greg has it take a waver as otherwise our LC would be able to flank charge a HC unit and rout that. He has to have the Mongol LC charge, of course, to also prevent the HC rout. It does, we rout the Mongol LC, causing 3 wavers...all of which are passed. We learn that Artillery count as 'other' bodies and thus can receive support from any steady friendly within 240.

On my side (our left) I am able to get a SHK/EHK unit into the flank of a Korean foot unit and rout it...all wavers are passed, sigh.

Here we'd have a 3-2 victory...except my knight unit, having routed the MI Koreans, is charged in both flanks by lancers. I dice my combat dice expecting to do enough not to rout...-3...really? Wink Ok, and of course neither of the Mongol lancers roll up, so my knight unit actually has to rout move before it is destroyed...causing multiple wavers on Irr D Prussians, who fail...putting the command under retreat exactly. I had also had bad luck earlier with a LC unit that had to evade off table (1/3rd chance, oops).

That put our 3-2 victory into a 2-4 or 2-5 loss.


Game 3 against Dan Woyke and Matt Kollmer with Inca
Dave and I are pretty tired at this point...and I'd imagine Dan and Matt are as well. We outscout them...and win the table side choice die roll forcing them to have their backs against a River (table with water all the way down the rear zone). However, we lose the main command placement die roll.

Deployment orders have Dave with the main command facing largely airy LI at a woods on the left flank, with the bulk of the Inca army deploying from center to their left, our right. That means there'll be a bunch of maneuvering and evading for a few turns. I also put lights in position to stop marches of the majority of the Inca units, who won't be doing much fighting.

Matt and Dan do get some redeployment going and are able to occupy a hilltop in their forward center. I make a mistake and move a LC unit a few millimeters too far forward, and then it fails a counter to skirmish back, and is shot to must rally disorder by a lot of slings...who are then able to approach up and shoot again. That LC unit is toasted, but takes so much damage before routing that it doesn't cause wavers.

I send a knight unit into a slightly out of position HTW,JLS,S,Sh unit and get a good die roll, routing it. 3 Inca wavers are taken, only the small LI unit fails.

I follow up with an impetuous Prussian unit into a LTS,S,Sh unit...and roll down, failing to rout it.

Inca 2HCT turn and charge my knight unit in the flank...I think, not a big deal, it's late in the game and I'll roll well enough not to be in too much trouble. Nope, -3...ok, knight unit loses...and is very soon routed, with my Prussian unit failing a waver. However, this is late enough that Matt can't exploit and I am still one unit away from the command going into retirement.

Meanwhile, Dave manages to get a cascading catch, rout, pursue, converted charge going against two LI units on the left. He also has reasonable die rolls and positioning against several of Woyke's units, earning some more routs...excepting for the regular SHK unit that charges a 2E Irr A LMI JLS,S,Sh unit (also charging it)...said Inca foot unit rolls up and ties the knights exactly so everybody is tired/disordered/locked.

Still, we end up with about a 4-2 victory here.

Ultimately the Prussians are very brittle...and have a limited life span on the table, particularly to any counter attacks (including frontally). Dave and I also don't play super regularly (Dave not for something like 3 years) and at least I can say I made a few mistakes.

Irr knights and the Prussians put our fate in the hand of multiple die rolls, with some key down rolls (including a couple of Prussian combats) hurting us, particularly against the Yuan.

Frank
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 6:40 pm    Post subject:

I don't think you can afford to use the 10IS cavalry and elephants for chasing down evaders. You have to rely on shooting to force light / skirmishing troops back, and then rely on shooting the next bound to induce wavers against troops that are in a must rally situation. Because your foot advances slowly, this often means that you can't get close enough for that killer follow up shot. The LMI B units can be helpful in that regard, since they move faster, and taking two of them is arguably better than taking just one and taking the LHI/LMI JLS,Sh unit. While I understand the temptation of that unit, you should avoid the temptation. Stick to the things the army excels at, instead of trying to diversify your possibilities.

Try to force the action with the combined arms attack of the firelance foot and the elephants working together. Even if you can't pull off such an attack (the foot are slow) the necessity to respond to this threat will often create a bend in your opponent's line somewhere that can be a focus of concentrated shooting.

All of which sounds great in theory. In practice, we're all out of practice. And this is a more finesse army than it looks like at first glance.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 8:08 pm    Post subject:

Thanks Frank!
Good to read up and reminisce!
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 10:19 pm    Post subject:

Mark Stone wrote:
I don't think you can afford to use the 10IS cavalry and elephants for chasing down evaders. You have to rely on shooting to force light / skirmishing troops back, and then rely on shooting the next bound to induce wavers against troops that are in a must rally situation. Because your foot advances slowly, this often means that you can't get close enough for that killer follow up shot. The LMI B units can be helpful in that regard, since they move faster, and taking two of them is arguably better than taking just one and taking the LHI/LMI JLS,Sh unit. While I understand the temptation of that unit, you should avoid the temptation. Stick to the things the army excels at, instead of trying to diversify your possibilities.

Try to force the action with the combined arms attack of the firelance foot and the elephants working together. Even if you can't pull off such an attack (the foot are slow) the necessity to respond to this threat will often create a bend in your opponent's line somewhere that can be a focus of concentrated shooting.

All of which sounds great in theory. In practice, we're all out of practice. And this is a more finesse army than it looks like at first glance.


Some fair criticism here...although as Mark also says, theory is great, until it meets practice.

The LHI/LMI JLS unit was useful, more so generally than another LMI archer unit would have been due to the fact that it could charge, get into contact with, and be advantaged against LMI Auxilia in battle one...and hold a woods against longbowmen with 2HCW in battle two.

In the limited testing I got in, having something that could hold or attack a terrain feature was very useful...as opposed to having to fall back with the loose archers.

The other difficulty is that against something like Early Burgundian and/or Neo-Babylonian/Assyrian, and in other cases, there may be little to no LC/LI to shoot up! That is, the bane of this mini for me was really my opponent's regular loose order foot...which I can't catch or shoot at, as the return shot would ruin me (at least causing a waver with D class troops while the enemy simply recalls).

I know they're D class, so using the little mounted I have to charge them once my close order foot have forced them into skirmish at least causes wavers on likely uneasy Ds.

I wish I had been matched up against opponents where I could actually have...yes...shot at them at close range.

Frank
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 3:47 pm    Post subject:

AAR: Kushan!

Three good games, a delightful teammate, and a chance to get outside my usual army box - the CW team tournament was a big success. Scott deserves all the credit (and beer) that he can stand, as ever; he and Rich have also done a fabulous job on terrain now, even if I'm still not sold on the pre-set approach.

I had planned to play with Chris Cameron, but he dropped out last-minute; then Scott H had agreed to fill in - that would have been very fun! - but when I turned up on the Sat a.m., it turned out that Rich Kroupa needed a partner and we'd have an even 10 teams. OK, so Rich has brought Kushan. What the heck is Kushan? Smile And why does it have 2E units of Irr C LI B in the list? [To be fair, Rich had a reason for that. I didn't say that it was a good reason Smile]

No worries. There are some good things about the list: I know what to do with SHC/EHC L, B units even if these are shieldless, and especially how to run them with elephants; all of the cav is either elephant-proof (my command) or camel-proof (Rich's). Nothing to fight in terrain, even worse than my Sassanids, but we get lucky and don't have much dense terrain all day. The whole thing is irregular, and so I am going to need to carefully shepherd my LC to not get into trouble, but they're good LC (L, B, Sh and elephant-proof).

First game we get the dunes table, which is fine except that peltasts are still much better than medium camels and we're fighting Alexander (Jevon and Sean Patrick). Jevon has the heavy command with all the El, facing Rich; I'm opposing Sean with a bunch of pikes, companions, and some LC. And I think Sean will forgive me for noting that he is out of practice: the game was over at deployment because the end of Sean's line was a couple of LC units without any real support, and I was confident that I could blow through those and turn on the pikes' flank. That's basically what happened, much faster than expected because I rolled long on the first charge and caught one of the two LC units on bound 2; if the pikes had anchored on the table edge and had the LC supported by their peltasts, it would have been a hard problem. On the other side, neither Rich nor Jevon is getting very far through the dunes - Jevon has a shot at getting El into camels' flank but has to take a waver to avoid being halted by shooting, fails it, and by that time Sean is on retreat.

Game 2 brings an army I had hoped to get a look at: Todd and Rob running an African Warrior list. I don't recall which one but I really like it: high-morale regular LMI with HG, JLS, Sh/B, JLS, Sh or LTS, JLS, D, Sh; close LTS, JLS, D, Sh; some decent cav. Also they get some woods on the table, but thankfully decide to fight in the open; still a tough fight. On my left I send a LC/HC/El combination to push between two woods against Rob's LC, and I am confident about winning eventually but that's the only place on the table I see good news. In the middle there's a long line of foot, and we have no chance against the MI so I steel myself to start hurling SHC and EL into the loose foot and hope. Rob passes all but one counter to get out of 120p and shoot -160-pace HG, ouch! - and then passes the first charge waver, not looking good. My SHC are never going to rout him but *do* manage to burst through; that's basically writing off the SHC unit in exchange for (i) a disordered rallying foot unit and (ii) enemy behind flank of his line. Which in combination with El makes even the Reg B LMI uneasy - and that turns out to be critical. Next bound I can send El into the disordered handgun block and SHC into both other LMI units - and they both roll just low enough to shake when uneasy, either from the initial charge or from one of the ensuring routs - I get the direction of combat in my favour. Combined with catching a LC unit on my left and a second failing to counter, then failing the waver test from being shot to disorder while within 80p of my elephants, that puts Rob on retreat, and both of us are a bit shocked at the outcome - I think we both expected the fight to be a decent one for him, but the initial burst-through set up a chain reaction. As in game 1, this happens fast enough that Rich and Todd have not yet done much, so we call it.

In games 1 and 2 I got to be the aggressor; game 3 flipped that. Bill Low and Dave Markowitz also have 10 points, running Mithridatic with 6 scythed chariots - a troop type that our lack of LI makes us very vulnerable to. Plus, Dave sets up opposite me and matches all of my LC with Scythian JLS, B, Sh who have a +1 advantage in a straight fight - we lose all the deployment rolls despite having more scouting. The good news is that Bill is both unreliable and on wait orders, with some cav on the very far end of his line that look to be a good target for camels. So Rich sets off for that goal. In the bound 1 LC shooting matchup, dice *strongly* favour me, aided a little by some elephant and SHC archery: all of Dave's LC are forced to recall while mine are not, and I catch one unit in the charge. The only thing that fails waver for that rout, though, is a scythed chariot (!). I lose the pursuing LC, too far away for anyone to care, so we're basically even except that the chariot is sitting there in front of Dave's big pike block, and it routs (!) when charged by my El - so it bursts through the pikes and my El are very happy. Over the next couple of bounds the pike shake but pass two wavers to not rout as the El push them back, and as the game is coming to an end Dave hits the El in the flank with peltasts but can't rout them; not much else happens other than some IrrA LMI Thracians trying to hunt down an El unit of mine, having the El counter out of reach and then having our MI LTS, Sh (whom I hadn't previously mentioned, giving you a sense of their role in the Kushan army) find something that they can actually beat: the shieldless flank of an LMI unit. The LMI evaporate on contact, too isolated to cause issues. So my side is a small win - but on the far flank, camels are in action, and specifically have routed some enemy HC and forced the supporting LC to flee so that the Kushans have turned the flank. Even better, Bill's dice go cold and the routing HC cause a bunch of units to shake; when Rich also routs some LI, the Mithridatic command is on retreat and we have the win.

Best part of the day? Getting to catch up with so many good friends - and that was glorious. The NorthEast dominance of attendees was notable; I will not be at Historicon (alas) but hope to see pretty much everyone at Council of 5 Nations this fall.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 6:28 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
160-pace HG, ouch!


Who wrote those lists? Rolling Eyes Razz

Clearly I need to review them. Wink

scott

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2016 7:00 pm    Post subject:

Since I played precious little, my AARs are more about any rule goofiness and other general items, like my trip out and back.

The out part was mundane, the back part, not so much. In the link I posted above, it's pretty clear to me now that I got there just after the the retired state trooper (and toll exchange robber) was shot and killed. Me and another guy doing 80 on the Turnpike saw 3 state cop cars flying up behind us maybe 20 miles from the interchange. They were doing at least 100mph. When I got there, there were emergency response vehicles everywhere and a big snowplow was completely blocking the exit. Once past, over the next 10-20 miles I counted another 8 state cops flying along coming from the other direction.

That little bit of distraction was the highlight of my 938 mile drive home in 12 hours and 50 minutes. The drive itself isn't as crappy as you might think but it also means I miss the post-tourney "hang" Saturday night. If my STL buds would go to Cold Wars (they seem to have bailed on the East shows for now), they're the ones that do the driving on Sunday so all I used to do was pour myself into the rented minivan and snooze the way home.

I got into Lancaster around 3pm Thursday and was at the Host by 4pm. Grabbed a beer from the bar and started setting up and doing typical space assignments for the GMs for the other systems I nominally manage as part of the Cold Wars convention staff/volunteers. Rich showed up with terrain so we got that unloaded and stashed in one of the former utility rooms. He hadn't read the forum (tsk, tsk) so didn't know that the Mini was Dogs of War. His Viking mini army couldn't be done for Dogs and he toyed with the idea of driving the 2 hours home to get something but then sanity prevailed and he took his lead for the Doubles tourney and cooked up a Hunnic list. We then sat down to play a Mini Dogs game.

It was historic! Not the game expertise but the matchup: Hunnic vs LIR. This gave me a chance to shake off the rust (haven't played since Hcon 15) and test run this list. I had 10 scouting so setup on 1/2 of the table meaning Rich could pick where he attacked. He went after my left flank and managed to recoil one of my legionary units off the board. But, I was able to catch one of his LC units over on the other flank with one of my experimental scythed chariots. 1-1 game although I was lucky the legionary unit recoiled off the board. I'm guessing the waver tests for its eventual rout would have changed things.

We had an even number for the Mini so I didn't play. Matt Kollmer was down with everybody but had gotten little sleep so I didn't press him into playing all day. However, we played each other in the Round 2 slot, he running Early Burgundians. I think it was either Todd or Dan who commented on Saturday why we didn't go ahead and integrate into Round 3 of the Mini. D'OH! It never occurred to me.

Matt had fewer scouting points than me, 7 to my 10 so deployment wasn't much of an issue. My goal with this army is to win the terrain battle while the legionaries suck up space and time in the clear sections and that worked like a charm. I had no qualms charging a 4E Reg B LMI JLS, D Sh Auxilia unit into one of his 4E Reg D 1/2 LHI/LMI 2HCW, LB, 1/2 shield units behind stakes. I didn't expect to win but if I stuck, next bound I would. Instead he rolled down, I rolled up and advanced across the stakes. Took two more bounds to break the unit but it happened. On the other flank he plowed the usual 2E SHK/EHK unit into a Legionary block but didn't do a CPF so was stuck there. Eventually I was able to again catch some of the LHI/LMI LB units with the experimental scythed chariots. I also caught his hapless mounted LC CB unit with my otherwise hapless Reg C LC, JLS, Sh unit. 4-1 me.

I was happy in that I got two games in plus got to see how these revisions to the scythed chariots played. We think we've struck the right balance with them so that you can expect em again during the Theme at Hcon.

Rules stuff wasn't too bad. We've stuck with replacing in combat by body and that worked well. One of the recent clarifications we published pertaining to that actually is incomplete now that we've seen it in action so expect another iteration of that before Hcon. As Frank mentioned upthread, the skirmishing issue was a surprise to him but I'd ruled it that way before, not always indicative of future rulings, but the rules seemed tight on it. You might not like the way it works but that's how it works and there's no reason to change it.

We had a number of issues pertaining to the simultaenousness of charging. I pointed out that the rules say "essentially simultaeneous" and there's am mechanism to follow that solves most of the issues. Once we worked thru it, I was pleased with the 3-4 outcomes I had to "curate".

Another question had to do with a foot element armed with 2HCW, JLS, Sh. The player didn't want to fight shieldless so wanted to "fight with my JLS only". I said not only no but hell no. And stuck with that despite the fact I could not find anything in the rules that disallowed that. I'd swear we had verbage at one point that covered it. Heh heh, another item for the next iteration of clarifications.

Frank also mentioned the major water feature in a rear zone. A brilliant idea on my part! Rich had done major water features for 15mm games and they were in 2' sections so fit perfectly. With us using Eric's Cockamamie Deployment system, even if you're outscouted you still have roughly 120p of space to deploy. Not everybody was so amused but expect to see it again. I said that if somebody flank marched with boats and came in on the rear area, I'd let em range up and down the thing.

It was great seeing some armies we haven't seen in a while, like the Early Teuts or better yet and army like Communal Italian place 2nd in the Dogs Mini.

As mentioned above, Bill Low loans out more armies than the law allows so even those people with lead, we now have a larger variety of armies to use.

scott

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Ed Kollmer
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 1:04 am    Post subject:

We've stuck with replacing in combat by body

What does that mean?????

As Frank mentioned upthread, the skirmishing issue was a surprise to him

What Skirmishing issue?????

Inquiring minds want to know!!
Ed the Inquirer
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Frank Gilson
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 5:02 pm    Post subject:

Ed Kollmer wrote:
We've stuck with replacing in combat by body

What does that mean?????

As Frank mentioned upthread, the skirmishing issue was a surprise to him

What Skirmishing issue?????

Inquiring minds want to know!!
Ed the Inquirer


Replacing in combat is by body, not element by element, as the rules stated all along, but we did not fully consider until later last year.

So, should you charge through your LI (or some other such permitted interpenetration), the entire LI body is placed back.

Skirmishers are treated as the most vulnerable target type within the element being shot at and behind it, regardless of whether elements behind actually do any shooting. So, if you have a 12E column of LHI JLS,Sh with the last element B,Sh, you are shieldless LMI for shooting target purposes.

Frank
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Mark Stone
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2016 7:43 pm    Post subject:

By the way, can I just say that I'm really heartened to see 20 players in the team tournament. That's a strong showing, and gives me hope that we'll be able to sustain our little community for some time to come.
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Ed Kollmer
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 12:09 am    Post subject:

OK! I got the body exchanging.
But don't get the other part.

Skirmishers are treated as the most vulnerable target type within the element being shot at and behind it, regardless of whether elements behind actually do any shooting. So, if you have a 12E column of LHI JLS,Sh with the last element B,Sh, you are shieldless LMI for shooting target purposes.


Now if I have my "irrational love" Andalusian army Very Happy
9El Spearmen (6El of MI Lts,Jls,sh) with back rank of MI B.
and some unfortunate player decides to face them with LI B.
The LI B shoot.
Do they shoot at the back rank MI B shieldless, rather than the front shielded MI Lts,Jls,sh.

Ed the Rash Irrational Lover
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Ewan McNay
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:09 am    Post subject:

Ed- not unless your MI are somehow in skimish formation Smile.
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