Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Greg,

I have to be honest, OW is really cool and I do happen to own some very
dusty Mongols (most likely Timurids) as well as an unpainted Khmer. I'm usually
thinking 1600 points. There are a number of armies that I didn't mention for
example Rajput, Vijanagara, Kushan, etc. . . that will pose a problem not to
mention the Han, Tang, various Korean. . . that can really give a cav army with
no punch problems. It reminds me of the heady days at Historicon when I used to
draw Bill Chris's Byzantines with me playing Burmese. Like someone said (Jon I
think), there will be lots of Light Cav taking waivers for second disorder
causes from shooting from elephants. I always loved seeing Cav armies and no
matter if your an excellent player, they really have problems with armies that
have decent shooting power along with elephants not to mention those that get
elephant proofed SHC/EHC types. Heck, my chances of winning have gone up in
Texas if your playing these guys without stuff to deal with
Elephants!

kelly

Greg Regets <greg.regets@...> wrote:

Ok Kelly ... exactly how many points are you playing with, and is
there some new list rule that says you get to roll all your terrain
choices before I get to roll any of mine? (wait, don't answer that
last part, as it might actually be true) ;-)

I know these are all "super armies" now, but for the most part they
are expensive and pretty damn small.

You're going to get your wish with this army, because after six years
of KofStJ, this is my new offering, complete with killer figures from
Museum! Of course when you come down here, for the most part it will
be two lists, largely removing this entire arguement. ;-)

g



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Greg,
>
> In a one list tournament, you will need to pray that you don't
hit armies like Sassanids, Timurids, Seleucids, Khmer, Burmese. The
first four have plenty of regular support types that will mess you up
and plenty of shooting foot that will keep you away. As far as the
Burmese and other irreg elephant armies go, you have nothing to go
into the woods to get their crappy support troops who I guarantee
will be hiding. Heck, even brush will make it hard for you to mess
with massed Irg D Lmi bows not to mention the guard foot who have the
crossbow in the Burmese army. You are a great player, but Elephants
give you serious trouble and the one answer for you that messes up
those guys are your skuts. Perhaps you could get some of those nice
cheap LMI B,Sh guys But they just don't stand up like Skuts do.
Additionally, when you take a 6 element skut, a knight player will
have to commit at least 2 kn units to win b/c kn's coming in are
5@5=20 not enough to do 1CPF and this doesn't take into
> account caltrops and darts which by the way will scare off most
elephants along with the LTS, JLS combo. Ofcourse Burmese are
probably more than happy to trade shots with you. . . but then that
becomes a tactics issue and who can split fire more effectively.
Personally, if I'm playing in a tournament with you, I'm praying you
take this list instead of your usual Knights of Saint John who can
effectively deal with any sort of army.
>
> kw
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
>
> You guys have elephants on the brain.
>
> Exactly how are these vaunted elephant armies in 15mm, going to a)
> catch me, b) protect the lights from my lights, c) put vulnerable
> things in terrain, d) cover the entire table ... and do them all at
> once?
>
> I like my chances against elephant armies with this host, and
again,
> we are talking about 15mm games.
>
> With this army, I'm more worried about protected foot that shoots
> back, mixed with knights ... armies like 100YW English, etc ... Not
> really much to do against that kind of army, and buying the
Byzantine
> infantry doesn't ameliorate that difficulty.
>
> How about a rew more basic questions.
>
> 1. Would you change the armamemt on the Regular LC, to either half
> JLS, half B ... or just take a few units of B only Regular LC?
>
> 2. Would you get rid of a Hun Noble and perhaps a LI unit or two,
and
> buy 2x 4-Stand regular LMI archer units?
>
> 3. What about taking all the LI as front rank S, back rank B, but
> keeping them in the same numbers?
>
> 4. As Jon and Ewan rightly pointed out (in my view), the Skutatoi
> just do not fit this army, and again thinking on Jon's comments,
> against the types of armies I see around here, if I bought them, it
> would tie my cavalry to a role of protecting them. With the number
of
> knights we see in this area, that might be problematic. How do you
> feel about buying Skuts, and artillery to support them?
>
> Thank you for the thoughts ... g
>
> P.S. Anyone figure out what the gully is for?
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > Greg,
> >
> > Where are the only stand up troops in this army (Skuts)!
Good
> luck against a Khmer or Burmese or for that matter any Elephant
army
> with regulars. . . These guys are interesting but I like their
Great
> great grand children much better. But you play like Hannibal so who
> knows. . .
> > k
> >
> > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> >
> > DAW 12. Early Byzantine (warm)
> >
> > 1x CinC Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh @200
> > 1x 2-in-C Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh @130
> > 1x Hunnic Sub Irr B HC L B Sh, +1 Hun Nobles Irr B HC L B Sh @105
> >
> > 2x Kavallarioi Lancers 2-Stands Reg B EHC L Sh @88ea = 176
> > 1x Gothic Cavalry 2-Stands Irr B HC L Sh @79
> > 2x Hunnic Nobles 2-Stands Irr B HC L B Sh @85ea = 170
> >
> > 4x Huns 4-Stands Irr C LC JLS B Sh @81ea = 324
> > 5x Kavallarioi Scouts 2-Stands Reg B LC JLS Sh @46ea = 230
> >
> > 4x Psiloi 2-Stand Reg C LI JLS Sh @26ea = 104
> > 2x Psiloi 4-Stand Reg C LI S Sh @42ea = 84
> >
> > Points = 1598
> > Scouting = 102
> > Terrain Choices = Road, Open, Open, Gully
> >
> >
> >
> >
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[Bill Chriss]

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Greg,
>
> I have to be honest, OW is really cool and I do happen to own
some very dusty Mongols (most likely Timurids) as well as an
unpainted Khmer. I'm usually thinking 1600 points. There are a
number of armies that I didn't mention for example Rajput,
Vijanagara, Kushan, etc. . . that will pose a problem not to mention
the Han, Tang, various Korean. . . that can really give a cav army
with no punch problems. It reminds me of the heady days at
Historicon when I used to draw Bill Chris's Byzantines with me
playing Burmese. Like someone said (Jon I think), there will be lots
of Light Cav taking waivers for second disorder causes from shooting
from elephants. [snip]

Ah yes, I have a dim recollection of this. From it I learned that
trouser wearing barbarians don't have to actually fight you to make
you run away. I became obsessed with anti-missile and anti-elephant
tactics, and then anti-knight tactics. Being basically contrarian,
this is what I continue to focus on. It is, after all, a rock,
paper, scissors game. And with due respect to the better players
here who clearly disagree, those of us with less tactical
sophistication still get a lot of bang for our bucks when we pick
rock and you've got scissors!



Greek

[Greg Regets]

Well Jon ... Persians would certainly be one of the bigger historical
opponents ... Ewan and Kelly have me feeling so badly outclassed, if
I get that matchup, I think I will just drink beer and read
Polybius. ;-)

All in good fun, and I'm glad you took it that way. :-)

g



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, JonCleaves@a... wrote:
>
> <<<GREG>>> Well, the obvious intent is to build an army that can
make
> an enemy "go online" using just over half the army ... and then
send
> the rest on flank march. This is probably going to be the only way
to
> consistantly win, a sad state of affairs for an army that took back
> the best 1/3 of the Roman empire, while holding off the Persians
and
> the Huns ...>>
>
> I would counter that this army should indeed do quite well against
its historical opponents. Now, if it goes tromping off into the
jungles of south central or southeast asia...wel...
>
>
> <<<GREG>>> Mongols are going to be a problem for anyone, as will
any
> of the new "Rose Colored Glasses" armies.>>
>
> Thanks for your support, Greg...! lol
>
> <<<GREG>>> ...but I've said many times (until
> blue in the face even) that this army list is simply not some of
> FHE's better work. >>>
>
> Indigo, I should think, at this point....lol
>
> J

[joncleaves]

All in good fun, and I'm glad you took it that way. >>

Indeed, smiles all around.

Good core discussion, though.

[Greg Regets]

All great armies to be sure Kelly! There is something about white
folks that get into "all things oriental" that makes them start
singing songs about the master race. ;-)

Your Burmese are more than welcome in San Antonio. It will complete
the trifecta of, four feet of walls and pikes with flaming pigs.

You will just have to live with everyone saying, "Man, she sure has a
nice army!"

Thanks ... g

P.S. This may have been the most politically incorrect post ever made
on this board. ;-)



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Greg,
>
> I have to be honest, OW is really cool and I do happen to own
some very dusty Mongols (most likely Timurids) as well as an
unpainted Khmer. I'm usually thinking 1600 points. There are a number
of armies that I didn't mention for example Rajput, Vijanagara,
Kushan, etc. . . that will pose a problem not to mention the Han,
Tang, various Korean. . . that can really give a cav army with no
punch problems. It reminds me of the heady days at Historicon when I
used to draw Bill Chris's Byzantines with me playing Burmese. Like
someone said (Jon I think), there will be lots of Light Cav taking
waivers for second disorder causes from shooting from elephants. I
always loved seeing Cav armies and no matter if your an excellent
player, they really have problems with armies that have decent
shooting power along with elephants not to mention those that get
elephant proofed SHC/EHC types. Heck, my chances of winning have gone
up in Texas if your playing these guys without stuff to deal with
> Elephants!
>
> kelly
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
>
> Ok Kelly ... exactly how many points are you playing with, and is
> there some new list rule that says you get to roll all your terrain
> choices before I get to roll any of mine? (wait, don't answer that
> last part, as it might actually be true)
>
> I know these are all "super armies" now, but for the most part they
> are expensive and pretty damn small.
>
> You're going to get your wish with this army, because after six
years
> of KofStJ, this is my new offering, complete with killer figures
from
> Museum! Of course when you come down here, for the most part it
will
> be two lists, largely removing this entire arguement.
>
> g
>
>
>
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > Greg,
> >
> > In a one list tournament, you will need to pray that you
don't
> hit armies like Sassanids, Timurids, Seleucids, Khmer, Burmese. The
> first four have plenty of regular support types that will mess you
up
> and plenty of shooting foot that will keep you away. As far as the
> Burmese and other irreg elephant armies go, you have nothing to go
> into the woods to get their crappy support troops who I guarantee
> will be hiding. Heck, even brush will make it hard for you to mess
> with massed Irg D Lmi bows not to mention the guard foot who have
the
> crossbow in the Burmese army. You are a great player, but Elephants
> give you serious trouble and the one answer for you that messes up
> those guys are your skuts. Perhaps you could get some of those nice
> cheap LMI B,Sh guys But they just don't stand up like Skuts do.
> Additionally, when you take a 6 element skut, a knight player will
> have to commit at least 2 kn units to win b/c kn's coming in are
> 5@5=20 not enough to do 1CPF and this doesn't take into
> > account caltrops and darts which by the way will scare off most
> elephants along with the LTS, JLS combo. Ofcourse Burmese are
> probably more than happy to trade shots with you. . . but then that
> becomes a tactics issue and who can split fire more effectively.
> Personally, if I'm playing in a tournament with you, I'm praying
you
> take this list instead of your usual Knights of Saint John who can
> effectively deal with any sort of army.
> >
> > kw
> >
> > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> >
> > You guys have elephants on the brain.
> >
> > Exactly how are these vaunted elephant armies in 15mm, going to
a)
> > catch me, b) protect the lights from my lights, c) put vulnerable
> > things in terrain, d) cover the entire table ... and do them all
at
> > once?
> >
> > I like my chances against elephant armies with this host, and
> again,
> > we are talking about 15mm games.
> >
> > With this army, I'm more worried about protected foot that shoots
> > back, mixed with knights ... armies like 100YW English, etc ...
Not
> > really much to do against that kind of army, and buying the
> Byzantine
> > infantry doesn't ameliorate that difficulty.
> >
> > How about a rew more basic questions.
> >
> > 1. Would you change the armamemt on the Regular LC, to either
half
> > JLS, half B ... or just take a few units of B only Regular LC?
> >
> > 2. Would you get rid of a Hun Noble and perhaps a LI unit or two,
> and
> > buy 2x 4-Stand regular LMI archer units?
> >
> > 3. What about taking all the LI as front rank S, back rank B, but
> > keeping them in the same numbers?
> >
> > 4. As Jon and Ewan rightly pointed out (in my view), the Skutatoi
> > just do not fit this army, and again thinking on Jon's comments,
> > against the types of armies I see around here, if I bought them,
it
> > would tie my cavalry to a role of protecting them. With the
number
> of
> > knights we see in this area, that might be problematic. How do
you
> > feel about buying Skuts, and artillery to support them?
> >
> > Thank you for the thoughts ... g
> >
> > P.S. Anyone figure out what the gully is for?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> > <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > > Greg,
> > >
> > > Where are the only stand up troops in this army (Skuts)!
> Good
> > luck against a Khmer or Burmese or for that matter any Elephant
> army
> > with regulars. . . These guys are interesting but I like their
> Great
> > great grand children much better. But you play like Hannibal so
who
> > knows. . .
> > > k
> > >
> > > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> > >
> > > DAW 12. Early Byzantine (warm)
> > >
> > > 1x CinC Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh @200
> > > 1x 2-in-C Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh @130
> > > 1x Hunnic Sub Irr B HC L B Sh, +1 Hun Nobles Irr B HC L B Sh
@105
> > >
> > > 2x Kavallarioi Lancers 2-Stands Reg B EHC L Sh @88ea = 176
> > > 1x Gothic Cavalry 2-Stands Irr B HC L Sh @79
> > > 2x Hunnic Nobles 2-Stands Irr B HC L B Sh @85ea = 170
> > >
> > > 4x Huns 4-Stands Irr C LC JLS B Sh @81ea = 324
> > > 5x Kavallarioi Scouts 2-Stands Reg B LC JLS Sh @46ea = 230
> > >
> > > 4x Psiloi 2-Stand Reg C LI JLS Sh @26ea = 104
> > > 2x Psiloi 4-Stand Reg C LI S Sh @42ea = 84
> > >
> > > Points = 1598
> > > Scouting = 102
> > > Terrain Choices = Road, Open, Open, Gully
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
> > > document.write('');
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
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> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
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> >
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> > Yahoo! Search presents - Jib Jab's 'Second Term'
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>
>
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> document.write('');
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[Kelly Wilkinson]

Greg,

I'm not saying your a poor player at all. I'm just saying that you need
something that will deal with elephants. But since you never leave Texas, you
will never really have to worry about that. If you ever leave said state, then
you might have to play in a single list tourney which would handicap you in your
list choice if it were the one you submitted here.

kelly

Greg Regets <greg.regets@...> wrote:

Well Jon ... Persians would certainly be one of the bigger historical
opponents ... Ewan and Kelly have me feeling so badly outclassed, if
I get that matchup, I think I will just drink beer and read
Polybius. ;-)

All in good fun, and I'm glad you took it that way. :-)

g



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, JonCleaves@a... wrote:
>
> <<<GREG>>> Well, the obvious intent is to build an army that can
make
> an enemy "go online" using just over half the army ... and then
send
> the rest on flank march. This is probably going to be the only way
to
> consistantly win, a sad state of affairs for an army that took back
> the best 1/3 of the Roman empire, while holding off the Persians
and
> the Huns ...>>
>
> I would counter that this army should indeed do quite well against
its historical opponents. Now, if it goes tromping off into the
jungles of south central or southeast asia...wel...
>
>
> <<<GREG>>> Mongols are going to be a problem for anyone, as will
any
> of the new "Rose Colored Glasses" armies.>>
>
> Thanks for your support, Greg...! lol
>
> <<<GREG>>> ...but I've said many times (until
> blue in the face even) that this army list is simply not some of
> FHE's better work. >>>
>
> Indigo, I should think, at this point....lol
>
> J




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Kelly Wilkinson]

LOL! Greg,

Haven't you heard? I'm a Khmer player now. Look at the list. Compare it to
the Burmese and you will see why. Oh, and I still get to use Burmese allies if I
want. But that Timurid is calling me ever so enticingly! Elephants with
Naptha bombs, "OOO Baby!"

kelly

Greg Regets <greg.regets@...> wrote:

All great armies to be sure Kelly! There is something about white
folks that get into "all things oriental" that makes them start
singing songs about the master race. ;-)

Your Burmese are more than welcome in San Antonio. It will complete
the trifecta of, four feet of walls and pikes with flaming pigs.

You will just have to live with everyone saying, "Man, she sure has a
nice army!"

Thanks ... g

P.S. This may have been the most politically incorrect post ever made
on this board. ;-)



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Greg,
>
> I have to be honest, OW is really cool and I do happen to own
some very dusty Mongols (most likely Timurids) as well as an
unpainted Khmer. I'm usually thinking 1600 points. There are a number
of armies that I didn't mention for example Rajput, Vijanagara,
Kushan, etc. . . that will pose a problem not to mention the Han,
Tang, various Korean. . . that can really give a cav army with no
punch problems. It reminds me of the heady days at Historicon when I
used to draw Bill Chris's Byzantines with me playing Burmese. Like
someone said (Jon I think), there will be lots of Light Cav taking
waivers for second disorder causes from shooting from elephants. I
always loved seeing Cav armies and no matter if your an excellent
player, they really have problems with armies that have decent
shooting power along with elephants not to mention those that get
elephant proofed SHC/EHC types. Heck, my chances of winning have gone
up in Texas if your playing these guys without stuff to deal with
> Elephants!
>
> kelly
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
>
> Ok Kelly ... exactly how many points are you playing with, and is
> there some new list rule that says you get to roll all your terrain
> choices before I get to roll any of mine? (wait, don't answer that
> last part, as it might actually be true)
>
> I know these are all "super armies" now, but for the most part they
> are expensive and pretty damn small.
>
> You're going to get your wish with this army, because after six
years
> of KofStJ, this is my new offering, complete with killer figures
from
> Museum! Of course when you come down here, for the most part it
will
> be two lists, largely removing this entire arguement.
>
> g
>
>
>
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > Greg,
> >
> > In a one list tournament, you will need to pray that you
don't
> hit armies like Sassanids, Timurids, Seleucids, Khmer, Burmese. The
> first four have plenty of regular support types that will mess you
up
> and plenty of shooting foot that will keep you away. As far as the
> Burmese and other irreg elephant armies go, you have nothing to go
> into the woods to get their crappy support troops who I guarantee
> will be hiding. Heck, even brush will make it hard for you to mess
> with massed Irg D Lmi bows not to mention the guard foot who have
the
> crossbow in the Burmese army. You are a great player, but Elephants
> give you serious trouble and the one answer for you that messes up
> those guys are your skuts. Perhaps you could get some of those nice
> cheap LMI B,Sh guys But they just don't stand up like Skuts do.
> Additionally, when you take a 6 element skut, a knight player will
> have to commit at least 2 kn units to win b/c kn's coming in are
> 5@5=20 not enough to do 1CPF and this doesn't take into
> > account caltrops and darts which by the way will scare off most
> elephants along with the LTS, JLS combo. Ofcourse Burmese are
> probably more than happy to trade shots with you. . . but then that
> becomes a tactics issue and who can split fire more effectively.
> Personally, if I'm playing in a tournament with you, I'm praying
you
> take this list instead of your usual Knights of Saint John who can
> effectively deal with any sort of army.
> >
> > kw
> >
> > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> >
> > You guys have elephants on the brain.
> >
> > Exactly how are these vaunted elephant armies in 15mm, going to
a)
> > catch me, b) protect the lights from my lights, c) put vulnerable
> > things in terrain, d) cover the entire table ... and do them all
at
> > once?
> >
> > I like my chances against elephant armies with this host, and
> again,
> > we are talking about 15mm games.
> >
> > With this army, I'm more worried about protected foot that shoots
> > back, mixed with knights ... armies like 100YW English, etc ...
Not
> > really much to do against that kind of army, and buying the
> Byzantine
> > infantry doesn't ameliorate that difficulty.
> >
> > How about a rew more basic questions.
> >
> > 1. Would you change the armamemt on the Regular LC, to either
half
> > JLS, half B ... or just take a few units of B only Regular LC?
> >
> > 2. Would you get rid of a Hun Noble and perhaps a LI unit or two,
> and
> > buy 2x 4-Stand regular LMI archer units?
> >
> > 3. What about taking all the LI as front rank S, back rank B, but
> > keeping them in the same numbers?
> >
> > 4. As Jon and Ewan rightly pointed out (in my view), the Skutatoi
> > just do not fit this army, and again thinking on Jon's comments,
> > against the types of armies I see around here, if I bought them,
it
> > would tie my cavalry to a role of protecting them. With the
number
> of
> > knights we see in this area, that might be problematic. How do
you
> > feel about buying Skuts, and artillery to support them?
> >
> > Thank you for the thoughts ... g
> >
> > P.S. Anyone figure out what the gully is for?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> > <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > > Greg,
> > >
> > > Where are the only stand up troops in this army (Skuts)!
> Good
> > luck against a Khmer or Burmese or for that matter any Elephant
> army
> > with regulars. . . These guys are interesting but I like their
> Great
> > great grand children much better. But you play like Hannibal so
who
> > knows. . .
> > > k
> > >
> > > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> > >
> > > DAW 12. Early Byzantine (warm)
> > >
> > > 1x CinC Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh @200
> > > 1x 2-in-C Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh @130
> > > 1x Hunnic Sub Irr B HC L B Sh, +1 Hun Nobles Irr B HC L B Sh
@105
> > >
> > > 2x Kavallarioi Lancers 2-Stands Reg B EHC L Sh @88ea = 176
> > > 1x Gothic Cavalry 2-Stands Irr B HC L Sh @79
> > > 2x Hunnic Nobles 2-Stands Irr B HC L B Sh @85ea = 170
> > >
> > > 4x Huns 4-Stands Irr C LC JLS B Sh @81ea = 324
> > > 5x Kavallarioi Scouts 2-Stands Reg B LC JLS Sh @46ea = 230
> > >
> > > 4x Psiloi 2-Stand Reg C LI JLS Sh @26ea = 104
> > > 2x Psiloi 4-Stand Reg C LI S Sh @42ea = 84
> > >
> > > Points = 1598
> > > Scouting = 102
> > > Terrain Choices = Road, Open, Open, Gully
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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[Greg Regets]

Why would I want to leave Texas ... there are Yankees north of
Austin. ;-)



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Greg,
>
> I'm not saying your a poor player at all. I'm just saying that
you need something that will deal with elephants. But since you never
leave Texas, you will never really have to worry about that. If you
ever leave said state, then you might have to play in a single list
tourney which would handicap you in your list choice if it were the
one you submitted here.
>
> kelly
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
>
> Well Jon ... Persians would certainly be one of the bigger
historical
> opponents ... Ewan and Kelly have me feeling so badly outclassed,
if
> I get that matchup, I think I will just drink beer and read
> Polybius.
>
> All in good fun, and I'm glad you took it that way.
>
> g
>
>
>
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, JonCleaves@a... wrote:
> >
> > <<<GREG>>> Well, the obvious intent is to build an army that can
> make
> > an enemy "go online" using just over half the army ... and then
> send
> > the rest on flank march. This is probably going to be the only
way
> to
> > consistantly win, a sad state of affairs for an army that took
back
> > the best 1/3 of the Roman empire, while holding off the Persians
> and
> > the Huns ...>>
> >
> > I would counter that this army should indeed do quite well
against
> its historical opponents. Now, if it goes tromping off into the
> jungles of south central or southeast asia...wel...
> >
> >
> > <<<GREG>>> Mongols are going to be a problem for anyone, as will
> any
> > of the new "Rose Colored Glasses" armies.>>
> >
> > Thanks for your support, Greg...! lol
> >
> > <<<GREG>>> ...but I've said many times (until
> > blue in the face even) that this army list is simply not some of
> > FHE's better work. >>>
> >
> > Indigo, I should think, at this point....lol
> >
> > J
>
>
>
>
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[Greg Regets]

Don't get too excited just yet big fella ... when Classical comes
out, there will be Hoplites with AK-47's.




--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> LOL! Greg,
>
> Haven't you heard? I'm a Khmer player now. Look at the list.
Compare it to the Burmese and you will see why. Oh, and I still get
to use Burmese allies if I want. But that Timurid is calling me ever
so enticingly! Elephants with Naptha bombs, "OOO Baby!"
>
> kelly
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
>
> All great armies to be sure Kelly! There is something about white
> folks that get into "all things oriental" that makes them start
> singing songs about the master race.
>
> Your Burmese are more than welcome in San Antonio. It will complete
> the trifecta of, four feet of walls and pikes with flaming pigs.
>
> You will just have to live with everyone saying, "Man, she sure has
a
> nice army!"
>
> Thanks ... g
>
> P.S. This may have been the most politically incorrect post ever
made
> on this board.
>
>
>
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > Greg,
> >
> > I have to be honest, OW is really cool and I do happen to
own
> some very dusty Mongols (most likely Timurids) as well as an
> unpainted Khmer. I'm usually thinking 1600 points. There are a
number
> of armies that I didn't mention for example Rajput, Vijanagara,
> Kushan, etc. . . that will pose a problem not to mention the Han,
> Tang, various Korean. . . that can really give a cav army with no
> punch problems. It reminds me of the heady days at Historicon when
I
> used to draw Bill Chris's Byzantines with me playing Burmese. Like
> someone said (Jon I think), there will be lots of Light Cav taking
> waivers for second disorder causes from shooting from elephants. I
> always loved seeing Cav armies and no matter if your an excellent
> player, they really have problems with armies that have decent
> shooting power along with elephants not to mention those that get
> elephant proofed SHC/EHC types. Heck, my chances of winning have
gone
> up in Texas if your playing these guys without stuff to deal with
> > Elephants!
> >
> > kelly
> >
> > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> >
> > Ok Kelly ... exactly how many points are you playing with, and is
> > there some new list rule that says you get to roll all your
terrain
> > choices before I get to roll any of mine? (wait, don't answer
that
> > last part, as it might actually be true)
> >
> > I know these are all "super armies" now, but for the most part
they
> > are expensive and pretty damn small.
> >
> > You're going to get your wish with this army, because after six
> years
> > of KofStJ, this is my new offering, complete with killer figures
> from
> > Museum! Of course when you come down here, for the most part it
> will
> > be two lists, largely removing this entire arguement.
> >
> > g
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> > <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > > Greg,
> > >
> > > In a one list tournament, you will need to pray that you
> don't
> > hit armies like Sassanids, Timurids, Seleucids, Khmer, Burmese.
The
> > first four have plenty of regular support types that will mess
you
> up
> > and plenty of shooting foot that will keep you away. As far as
the
> > Burmese and other irreg elephant armies go, you have nothing to
go
> > into the woods to get their crappy support troops who I guarantee
> > will be hiding. Heck, even brush will make it hard for you to
mess
> > with massed Irg D Lmi bows not to mention the guard foot who have
> the
> > crossbow in the Burmese army. You are a great player, but
Elephants
> > give you serious trouble and the one answer for you that messes
up
> > those guys are your skuts. Perhaps you could get some of those
nice
> > cheap LMI B,Sh guys But they just don't stand up like Skuts do.
> > Additionally, when you take a 6 element skut, a knight player
will
> > have to commit at least 2 kn units to win b/c kn's coming in are
> > 5@5=20 not enough to do 1CPF and this doesn't take into
> > > account caltrops and darts which by the way will scare off
most
> > elephants along with the LTS, JLS combo. Ofcourse Burmese are
> > probably more than happy to trade shots with you. . . but then
that
> > becomes a tactics issue and who can split fire more effectively.
> > Personally, if I'm playing in a tournament with you, I'm praying
> you
> > take this list instead of your usual Knights of Saint John who
can
> > effectively deal with any sort of army.
> > >
> > > kw
> > >
> > > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> > >
> > > You guys have elephants on the brain.
> > >
> > > Exactly how are these vaunted elephant armies in 15mm, going to
> a)
> > > catch me, b) protect the lights from my lights, c) put
vulnerable
> > > things in terrain, d) cover the entire table ... and do them
all
> at
> > > once?
> > >
> > > I like my chances against elephant armies with this host, and
> > again,
> > > we are talking about 15mm games.
> > >
> > > With this army, I'm more worried about protected foot that
shoots
> > > back, mixed with knights ... armies like 100YW English, etc ...
> Not
> > > really much to do against that kind of army, and buying the
> > Byzantine
> > > infantry doesn't ameliorate that difficulty.
> > >
> > > How about a rew more basic questions.
> > >
> > > 1. Would you change the armamemt on the Regular LC, to either
> half
> > > JLS, half B ... or just take a few units of B only Regular LC?
> > >
> > > 2. Would you get rid of a Hun Noble and perhaps a LI unit or
two,
> > and
> > > buy 2x 4-Stand regular LMI archer units?
> > >
> > > 3. What about taking all the LI as front rank S, back rank B,
but
> > > keeping them in the same numbers?
> > >
> > > 4. As Jon and Ewan rightly pointed out (in my view), the
Skutatoi
> > > just do not fit this army, and again thinking on Jon's
comments,
> > > against the types of armies I see around here, if I bought
them,
> it
> > > would tie my cavalry to a role of protecting them. With the
> number
> > of
> > > knights we see in this area, that might be problematic. How do
> you
> > > feel about buying Skuts, and artillery to support them?
> > >
> > > Thank you for the thoughts ... g
> > >
> > > P.S. Anyone figure out what the gully is for?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> > > <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > > > Greg,
> > > >
> > > > Where are the only stand up troops in this army (Skuts)!
> > Good
> > > luck against a Khmer or Burmese or for that matter any Elephant
> > army
> > > with regulars. . . These guys are interesting but I like their
> > Great
> > > great grand children much better. But you play like Hannibal so
> who
> > > knows. . .
> > > > k
> > > >
> > > > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > DAW 12. Early Byzantine (warm)
> > > >
> > > > 1x CinC Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh @200
> > > > 1x 2-in-C Reg A HC L B Sh, +1 Boukellarioi Reg A HC L B Sh
@130
> > > > 1x Hunnic Sub Irr B HC L B Sh, +1 Hun Nobles Irr B HC L B Sh
> @105
> > > >
> > > > 2x Kavallarioi Lancers 2-Stands Reg B EHC L Sh @88ea = 176
> > > > 1x Gothic Cavalry 2-Stands Irr B HC L Sh @79
> > > > 2x Hunnic Nobles 2-Stands Irr B HC L B Sh @85ea = 170
> > > >
> > > > 4x Huns 4-Stands Irr C LC JLS B Sh @81ea = 324
> > > > 5x Kavallarioi Scouts 2-Stands Reg B LC JLS Sh @46ea = 230
> > > >
> > > > 4x Psiloi 2-Stand Reg C LI JLS Sh @26ea = 104
> > > > 2x Psiloi 4-Stand Reg C LI S Sh @42ea = 84
> > > >
> > > > Points = 1598
> > > > Scouting = 102
> > > > Terrain Choices = Road, Open, Open, Gully
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
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[Mike Bard]

Hmph. I was hoping for air strikes myself. :)

Michael Bard
That Greek Hoplite Guy (getting increasingly desperate for a Cold Wars
doubles partner)

Don't get too excited just yet big fella ... when Classical comes
out, there will be Hoplites with AK-47's.