Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

OK after repeated beatings I've succumb to logic. Here is my Scot's
army of the later period. Seems a bit fragile, but then I'm just not
used to running so heavy a foot army as this:

CNC +5 IrgB EHK L/sh
2E IrgB EHK L/sh
2x 8E IrgC MI LTS/sh
6E IrgC LI B

Ally Highlander as IrgC LMI J/sh
2x 6E IrgA/C LMI 2HCW/J&B/sh
6E IrgC LI J/sh

Ally Frenchie +5 IrgB SHK L/sh
2E IrgA/B SHK L/sh
4E IrgC LMI J/.5 sh
4E RegD LMI CB

I'm not sure I want to put the Highlander ally general in a unit, as
it would not help to have a general charge unprompted at first
opportunity and rout for having the charge cancelled by mounted
chargers, fail the stand and take it waver test, then take 3CPF and
more :)

Anyway this army seems to need terrain to cut down frontage, yet
needs enough open to give the yeomanry and kniggits a place to
exist. Any thoughts?
Wanax

[Todd Schneider]

Lots and lots of brush.


--- spocksleftball <spocksleftball@...> wrote:

---------------------------------
OK after repeated beatings I've succumb to logic.
Here is my Scot's
army of the later period. Seems a bit fragile, but
then I'm just not
used to running so heavy a foot army as this:

CNC +5 IrgB EHK L/sh
2E IrgB EHK L/sh
2x 8E IrgC MI LTS/sh
6E IrgC LI B

Ally Highlander as IrgC LMI J/sh
2x 6E IrgA/C LMI 2HCW/J&B/sh
6E IrgC LI J/sh

Ally Frenchie +5 IrgB SHK L/sh
2E IrgA/B SHK L/sh
4E IrgC LMI J/.5 sh
4E RegD LMI CB

I'm not sure I want to put the Highlander ally general
in a unit, as
it would not help to have a general charge unprompted
at first
opportunity and rout for having the charge cancelled
by mounted
chargers, fail the stand and take it waver test, then
take 3CPF and
more :)

Anyway this army seems to need terrain to cut down
frontage, yet
needs enough open to give the yeomanry and kniggits a
place to
exist. Any thoughts?
Wanax



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[Kelly Wilkinson]

lol! Good point Todd. Boyd, let me study this. How many points are we talking?
Standard 1600 or 1250?

kelly

Todd Schneider <thresh1642@...> wrote:
Lots and lots of brush.


--- spocksleftball <spocksleftball@...> wrote:

---------------------------------
OK after repeated beatings I've succumb to logic.
Here is my Scot's
army of the later period. Seems a bit fragile, but
then I'm just not
used to running so heavy a foot army as this:

CNC +5 IrgB EHK L/sh
2E IrgB EHK L/sh
2x 8E IrgC MI LTS/sh
6E IrgC LI B

Ally Highlander as IrgC LMI J/sh
2x 6E IrgA/C LMI 2HCW/J&B/sh
6E IrgC LI J/sh

Ally Frenchie +5 IrgB SHK L/sh
2E IrgA/B SHK L/sh
4E IrgC LMI J/.5 sh
4E RegD LMI CB

I'm not sure I want to put the Highlander ally general
in a unit, as
it would not help to have a general charge unprompted
at first
opportunity and rout for having the charge cancelled
by mounted
chargers, fail the stand and take it waver test, then
take 3CPF and
more :)

Anyway this army seems to need terrain to cut down
frontage, yet
needs enough open to give the yeomanry and kniggits a
place to
exist. Any thoughts?
Wanax



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

1200pt.

The more I look, the more this is Syracusan Greek army with some
aztecs and some SHK overlay. I think that at 1600pt it would be a
good army, as you could pick up some HK seargents and 2 more 8E
yeoman units. But at 1200pt I just think it is too little of
everything and not enough of anything. I have just one shot with the
French Kn, who are still trying to hide behind shieldless LMI CB.
The one working aspect is the highlanders, but this assumes a
reliable command and brush. Also the IrgA will mean the Bow are used
2 times: 1 prep shot, then 1 support shot. I went with the choppers
in front, JLS behind because there is no nifty upgrade to 1.5 ranks
of 2HCT for highlanders. Just my concerns.
Wanax

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> lol! Good point Todd. Boyd, let me study this. How many points are
we talking? Standard 1600 or 1250?
>
> kelly
>
> Todd Schneider <thresh1642@s...> wrote:
> Lots and lots of brush.
>
>
> --- spocksleftball <spocksleftball@y...> wrote:
>
> ---------------------------------
> OK after repeated beatings I've succumb to logic.
> Here is my Scot's
> army of the later period. Seems a bit fragile, but
> then I'm just not
> used to running so heavy a foot army as this:
>
> CNC +5 IrgB EHK L/sh
> 2E IrgB EHK L/sh
> 2x 8E IrgC MI LTS/sh
> 6E IrgC LI B
>
> Ally Highlander as IrgC LMI J/sh
> 2x 6E IrgA/C LMI 2HCW/J&B/sh
> 6E IrgC LI J/sh
>
> Ally Frenchie +5 IrgB SHK L/sh
> 2E IrgA/B SHK L/sh
> 4E IrgC LMI J/.5 sh
> 4E RegD LMI CB
>
> I'm not sure I want to put the Highlander ally general
> in a unit, as
> it would not help to have a general charge unprompted
> at first
> opportunity and rout for having the charge cancelled
> by mounted
> chargers, fail the stand and take it waver test, then
> take 3CPF and
> more
>
> Anyway this army seems to need terrain to cut down
> frontage, yet
> needs enough open to give the yeomanry and kniggits a
> place to
> exist. Any thoughts?
> Wanax
>
>
>
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[Kelly Wilkinson]

Boyd,
Just my thoughts here. I agree with your assessment that at 1600 points
this is a much better army. But any army containing SHK L, Sh and the expense
you pay for shock troops will hurt! Having this in mind I offer the following
1600 point army...

Cinc as HC L, Sh PA + 2 Irg B HC L, Sh
@133
6 Scottish Knights Irg 1/2 "B" !/2"C" HC L, Sh
@73
24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2Hi 1/2 Mi LTS, Sh @121
24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2 Hi 1/2 Mi LTS, Sh @121
24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2 Hi 1/2 Mi LTS, Sh @121
24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2 Hi 1/2 Mi LTS, Sh @121
12 Ettrick Archers Irg C Li B
@49
12 Ettrick Archers Irg C Li B
@49
12 Highland Scouts Irg C Li B, Sh
@61
18 Highland Warriors Irg C LMI JLS, Sh
@79
18 Highland Warriors Irg C LMI JLS, B, Sh
@97

French Ally Gen As SHK L, Sh, w/ PA std + 2 Irg A SHK L, Sh +
3 Irg B SHK L, Sh
@174
6 French Knights Irg 1/2 A 1/2 B SHK L, Sh
@136
6 French Knights Irg 1/2 A 1/2 B SHK L, Sh
@136
12 French Brigans Irg C LHI JLS, 1/2 Sh
@81
8 French Crossbowmen Reg D LMI CB @42

First of all, you may ask why I don't upgrade my Cinc or Scottish Knights? My
opinion is that The people that fight to win should not be the heir or current
King of Scotland! It's the French Knights that you have taken for allies and
they need to earn their keep! Besides, it is they with their Irg A's that will
make or break any type of fight. Next, I consider the Highlanders to be merely
support troops along with the Frenchie foot. The Brigans and Highlanders armed
with JLS should be enough to dig anyone out of a woods while the LI B types in
conjunction with Crossbows and Highland Foot with the JLS,B,Sh combo take the
brush. The 96 Yeomen can cover any terrain that is left over while the French
Knights take the Mailed fist approach and go for the weak spot in or simply
support a general advance by the Lowlander Yeomen to push the enemy off the
table. One option open to you would be to consider no armor for the lowlanders
and this would afford you an extra 8 MI towards your yeoman
units. I particularly like the armor though especially against the most
prevalent weapons in the game(JLS&B). Certainly there are better armies but for
the period and comparison of the 3 we are talking about, this can be quite a
good army to fight with. Also, I like this army with lots of Ally Generals
because of all the treachery that seemed to go on in this period in Scotland!
Besides you can name each of your units after the various Clan names, giving the
most treacherous to your Highland Ally Gen! I suggest Clan MacDonald since they
often sided with the "Anglish!"
Terrain wise, with all Irregular armies I play, I try to shrink it down as
much as I can. I would take a major Water feature, a marsh, a brush and a woods.
Your Lowlanders are your 5th terrain piece and will be hell on wheels to kill.
Also, since you will be outscouted 95% of the time, I would make sure to force
march the LI And/or 1 or 2 of the Lowlander units. There are few things more
intimidating to an opponent than seeing a big deployment to the center. But it
still would be best just to do so with your lights in order to allow you some
wiggle room.
Army size definitely is an issue here, but comparing this to Syracusans is
like comparing apples with pineapples. The Syracusans don't have anything that
can compare to the cost or hitting power of SHK. If you want a bigger Army @ low
points I suggest Arab Empire as that is what I'm famous for lately. :)

kelly


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[Kelly Wilkinson]

spocksleftball <spocksleftball@...> wrote:

CNC +5 IrgB EHK L/sh
2E IrgB EHK L/sh
2x 8E IrgC MI LTS/sh
6E IrgC LI B

Ally Highlander as IrgC LMI J/sh
2x 6E IrgA/C LMI 2HCW/J&B/sh
6E IrgC LI J/sh

Ally Frenchie +5 IrgB SHK L/sh
2E IrgA/B SHK L/sh
4E IrgC LMI J/.5 sh
4E RegD LMI CB

I'm not sure I want to put the Highlander ally general in a unit, as
it would not help to have a general charge unprompted at first
opportunity and rout for having the charge cancelled by mounted
chargers, fail the stand and take it waver test, then take 3CPF and
more :)

*************************************************************

Boyd, If your Highlander General in this case charges, he will be part of an
Irg"A" front rank unit. This usually means that his initial charge will be
impetuous which cannot be cancelled by mounted. And woe to any that meet him
when he rolls up 6!

***********************************************************

Anyway this army seems to need terrain to cut down frontage, yet
needs enough open to give the yeomanry and kniggits a place to
exist. Any thoughts?
Wanax

***********************************************************

This army seems to be a better 1600 point army too me as that affords you more
knights. It seems the greater the points the more hitting power you can get. But
compared to contemorary armys of the period, there are few that are much
different save those that can get lots of cheap regular foot.

kelly

**********************************************************




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--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Cinc as HC L, Sh PA + 2 Irg B HC L,
Sh @133
> 6 Scottish Knights Irg 1/2 "B" !/2"C" HC L,
Sh @73
> 24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2Hi 1/2 Mi LTS,
Sh @121
> 24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2 Hi 1/2 Mi LTS,
Sh @121
> 24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2 Hi 1/2 Mi LTS,
Sh @121
> 24 Lowland yeomen Irg C 1/2 Hi 1/2 Mi LTS,
Sh @121
> 12 Ettrick Archers Irg C Li
B @49
> 12 Ettrick Archers Irg C Li
B @49
> 12 Highland Scouts Irg C Li B,
Sh @61
> 18 Highland Warriors Irg C LMI JLS,
Sh @79
> 18 Highland Warriors Irg C LMI JLS, B,
Sh @97
>
> French Ally Gen As SHK L, Sh, w/ PA std + 2 Irg A SHK L, Sh +
> 3 Irg B SHK L,
Sh
@174
> 6 French Knights Irg 1/2 A 1/2 B SHK L,
Sh @136
> 6 French Knights Irg 1/2 A 1/2 B SHK L,
Sh @136
> 12 French Brigans Irg C LHI JLS, 1/2
Sh @81
> 8 French Crossbowmen Reg D LMI
CB @42
>

Army looks good but I dont see the highland ally required to pick up
the clansmen.

>Next, I consider the Highlanders to be merely support troops along
>with the Frenchie foot.

Thought about this approach, but the IrrA would mean they are a
threat unto themselves and as such make brush an unwelcome place for
those things that SHK fear most. This is what I find most enjoyable
about this army is that you get IrgA SHK and IrgA LMI in the same
army :)


>Also, since you will be outscouted 95% of the time, I would make
sure to force march the LI And/or 1 or 2 of the Lowlander units.

I find that 1 or 2 LI units on the small board will lock the enemy in
nicely.

> Army size definitely is an issue here, but comparing this to
Syracusans is like comparing apples with pineapples. The Syracusans
don't have anything that can compare to the cost or hitting power of
SHK.

Well I made that analogy as the Sryacusans get the wall o' crap close
order to push forward while they IrgA LMI Gauls and 4hourse LCh act
as the punches. Thus the analogy was a loose order foot and mounted
punch from behind solid mobile terrain. Yes, the SHK are a step up.


If you want a bigger Army @ low points I suggest Arab Empire as that
is what I'm famous for lately.
>
> kelly

Actually Kelly I'm trying to find a small effective army. I think if
I could find a way to put a small number of units on the table and
win, it would be far more impressive :)

Wanax

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Boyd,
One approach you could use for your Irg "A" Highlanders is to only make one
or two elements Irg"A's" Making them always eager and happy and thus not so
silly that they would have to charge out of the brush. Just a thought. It seems
you are bent on a later Kniggit army and to be honest, I've seen Greg Regets
play the Knights of Saint John and they can have the cheapest crap to the most
expensive stuff depending on your tastes. He runs it with lost of Sub-generals
and it can maneuver like the wind if you want it too. I can see numerous types
of armies using this list. Perhaps it's worth a look. "Greg if your reading this
post would you mind piping in?" I know that for centuries the Knights of Saint
John got by with small yet very effective armies historically. Maybe that is
just what the doctor ordered!

kelly


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Ummm, if your Highlander was Irr A, you can convince him to be
impetious (like you could stop him?) mixed with the 2HCW/JLS boys and
charge the mounted at 120 paces, then roll the big plus!



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "spocksleftball"
<spocksleftball@y...> wrote:
> OK after repeated beatings I've succumb to logic. Here is my
Scot's
> army of the later period. Seems a bit fragile, but then I'm just
not
> used to running so heavy a foot army as this:
>
> CNC +5 IrgB EHK L/sh
> 2E IrgB EHK L/sh
> 2x 8E IrgC MI LTS/sh
> 6E IrgC LI B
>
> Ally Highlander as IrgC LMI J/sh
> 2x 6E IrgA/C LMI 2HCW/J&B/sh
> 6E IrgC LI J/sh
>
> Ally Frenchie +5 IrgB SHK L/sh
> 2E IrgA/B SHK L/sh
> 4E IrgC LMI J/.5 sh
> 4E RegD LMI CB
>
> I'm not sure I want to put the Highlander ally general in a unit,
as
> it would not help to have a general charge unprompted at first
> opportunity and rout for having the charge cancelled by mounted
> chargers, fail the stand and take it waver test, then take 3CPF and
> more
>
> Anyway this army seems to need terrain to cut down frontage, yet
> needs enough open to give the yeomanry and kniggits a place to
> exist. Any thoughts?
> Wanax

Yup, but that would be the last I saw of him and soon after his
entire command :)

My experience with IrgA LMI is to wave goodbye from a safe distance
Wanax

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Honeyman"
<loki_in_oz@y...> wrote:
> Ummm, if your Highlander was Irr A, you can convince him to be
> impetious (like you could stop him?) mixed with the 2HCW/JLS boys
and
> charge the mounted at 120 paces, then roll the big plus!
>