Warrior Ancient and Medieval Rules

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Your certainly right that you have explained this before. For some reason it
didn't click with me. This really isn't a pet issue with me. I just didn't get
it. You explained it too me then but here you gave me a place in the rules to
look along with your reasoning. For that, thanks. Now I understand it much
better. Now for a follow on question. There are two units of bows facing a unit
of elephants. One bow unit is directly in front of the other bow unit. Do they
both get to shoot? Diagram would look something like this. I think they both
should but still have my doubts. . .

ELELEL

BBBBB

BBBBB



Jon <JonCleaves@...> wrote:

>
>
> ***Jon,
> I'm sorry that your annoyed, it's just that when "WE" here in
Kansas City are told one thing by you, the rules guru, and then we
go to the NICT and it's over-ruled by Scott Holder, I am the one
that is more than annoyed. . .>>

I do NOT want to get into this, but I also don't like how this issue
has been portrayed and want to set the record straight.

Scott is the ump at the NICT. His word is law in that venue. There
are even times when I get ruled against - and I should. If I
haven't made my intent clear enough for him to understand as a
fellow member of FHE, then I 'deserve' whatever judgment he feels is
best. Period. And believe me, I have....lol

In any case, I am not in charge of what rulings come in anyone
else's tourney and I will not be. I am human - and it is tough to
watch an ump rule differently than I intended. But in the end, I
have no one to blame but myself. The ump is the man, and I have
plenty of soccer red cards to prove it...

Therefore, when I answer rules questions I answer them as the author
with the official answer. If someone doesn't like what their ump
does with that answer, I can't help that. FHE is NOT in the
business of telling folks how to run their events.

<<more like exasperated b/c I really don't understand how the rule
is supposed to work. I still don't understand.>>

As you know, but fail to point out here, I have explained this rule
to you on several occasions in person. You have clearly understood
what I have said. I am aware that you tried to play it that you
could shoot your elephants over your own archers to double frontage
on missile power. Who wouldn't 'want' this...? lol But don't act
like I haven't already been asked this question multiple times by
you and don't act like you didn't get what I said. In fact, I gave
you exactly the same historical reasoning for the rule that I gave
here yesterday during our game in the league playoffs not more than
ten days ago.

<<Perhaps it's because I have never encountered such a rule or my
own ignorance,but I will tell you this, I don't blame my students
for not comprehending my lesson. I certainly don't ignore their
questions. But then again, you are not a teacher or are you? I plead
the same ignorance as Todd Kaeser. I ask for the same patience as
him.>>

I am a teacher, and you know it. Todd doesn't pull this stuff - he
can have whatever he wants from me. This isn't about you not
getting what I said and you know it.

I'm done with this one.

J




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[joncleaves]

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Your certainly right that you have explained this before. For some
reason it didn't click with me. This really isn't a pet issue with
me. I just didn't get it. You explained it too me then but here you
gave me a place in the rules to look along with your reasoning. For
that, thanks. Now I understand it much better. Now for a follow on
question. There are two units of bows facing a unit of elephants.
One bow unit is directly in front of the other bow unit. Do they
both get to shoot? Diagram would look something like this. I think
they both should but still have my doubts. . .
>
> ELELEL
>
> BBBBB
>
> BBBBB
>

No. See yesterday's answer to this very same question. The one
containing: "No other overhead shooting is permitted, even if to or
from a greater height."
J

[joncleaves]

--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, Ewan McNay <ewan.mcnay@y...>
wrote:
> > - In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Jon" <JonCleaves@a...> wrote:
>
> > There are even times when I get ruled against - and I should.
>
> Actually, shouldn't it be the case that if there is enough
ambiguity to
> have a difference of opinion, the rules author automatically gets
ruled
> against?>>

To both our credit, I was smart enough to look for and find the
at the end of this post and you were kind enough to put it there.

And, please don't give Scott any ideas! lol

J

[Kelly Wilkinson]

Good points Greg,

I'm still slowly working on getting that Knights of Saint John painted. But
still considering Timurids. With a Mongol army at least I won't need an MP when
the LC evade or recall. :)

kw

Greg Regets <greg.regets@...> wrote:

Referees at a tournament are like officials in a sporting event.

You have to go in it with the mindset that they will do a perfect job
at just about the same percentage that players play perfect games. I
have been playing since TOG 6.0 and have never once played a perfect
game.

Also consider that the bad thing that happen to you, always looks
worse than those that happen to everyone else ... but as there is a
clear understanding that there will probably never be a perfectly
refereed tournament, there are in fact bad things happening to
everyone.

It really all does tend to come out in the wash.

What has really helped me the most over the years (not that I'm the
worlds greatest player or anything) is making tactics and army lists
that don't rely on any single factor, in order to win. That way, if a
call or two doesn't go my way, there are still many other clubs in
the bag.

Thanks ... g




- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Jon" <JonCleaves@a...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > ***Jon,
> > I'm sorry that your annoyed, it's just that when "WE" here
in
> Kansas City are told one thing by you, the rules guru, and then we
> go to the NICT and it's over-ruled by Scott Holder, I am the one
> that is more than annoyed. . .>>
>
> I do NOT want to get into this, but I also don't like how this
issue
> has been portrayed and want to set the record straight.
>
> Scott is the ump at the NICT. His word is law in that venue.
There
> are even times when I get ruled against - and I should. If I
> haven't made my intent clear enough for him to understand as a
> fellow member of FHE, then I 'deserve' whatever judgment he feels
is
> best. Period. And believe me, I have....lol
>
> In any case, I am not in charge of what rulings come in anyone
> else's tourney and I will not be. I am human - and it is tough to
> watch an ump rule differently than I intended. But in the end, I
> have no one to blame but myself. The ump is the man, and I have
> plenty of soccer red cards to prove it...
>
> Therefore, when I answer rules questions I answer them as the
author
> with the official answer. If someone doesn't like what their ump
> does with that answer, I can't help that. FHE is NOT in the
> business of telling folks how to run their events.
>
> <<more like exasperated b/c I really don't understand how the rule
> is supposed to work. I still don't understand.>>
>
> As you know, but fail to point out here, I have explained this rule
> to you on several occasions in person. You have clearly understood
> what I have said. I am aware that you tried to play it that you
> could shoot your elephants over your own archers to double frontage
> on missile power. Who wouldn't 'want' this...? lol But don't act
> like I haven't already been asked this question multiple times by
> you and don't act like you didn't get what I said. In fact, I gave
> you exactly the same historical reasoning for the rule that I gave
> here yesterday during our game in the league playoffs not more than
> ten days ago.
>
> <<Perhaps it's because I have never encountered such a rule or my
> own ignorance,but I will tell you this, I don't blame my students
> for not comprehending my lesson. I certainly don't ignore their
> questions. But then again, you are not a teacher or are you? I
plead
> the same ignorance as Todd Kaeser. I ask for the same patience as
> him.>>
>
> I am a teacher, and you know it. Todd doesn't pull this stuff - he
> can have whatever he wants from me. This isn't about you not
> getting what I said and you know it.
>
> I'm done with this one.
>
> J




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Greg Regets]

Well, if you play an army like Timurids down in South Texas, expect
to get called Miss Wilkinson. Kelly is already too close to a girl's
name. Why take that risk? ;-)

Play something second tier and save armies like that for less
experienced players. More glory to you when you win!!!!

g




--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Good points Greg,
>
> I'm still slowly working on getting that Knights of Saint John
painted. But still considering Timurids. With a Mongol army at least
I won't need an MP when the LC evade or recall.
>
> kw
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
>
> Referees at a tournament are like officials in a sporting event.
>
> You have to go in it with the mindset that they will do a perfect
job
> at just about the same percentage that players play perfect games.
I
> have been playing since TOG 6.0 and have never once played a
perfect
> game.
>
> Also consider that the bad thing that happen to you, always looks
> worse than those that happen to everyone else ... but as there is a
> clear understanding that there will probably never be a perfectly
> refereed tournament, there are in fact bad things happening to
> everyone.
>
> It really all does tend to come out in the wash.
>
> What has really helped me the most over the years (not that I'm the
> worlds greatest player or anything) is making tactics and army
lists
> that don't rely on any single factor, in order to win. That way, if
a
> call or two doesn't go my way, there are still many other clubs in
> the bag.
>
> Thanks ... g
>
>
>
>
> - In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Jon" <JonCleaves@a...> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > ***Jon,
> > > I'm sorry that your annoyed, it's just that when "WE" here
> in
> > Kansas City are told one thing by you, the rules guru, and then
we
> > go to the NICT and it's over-ruled by Scott Holder, I am the one
> > that is more than annoyed. . .>>
> >
> > I do NOT want to get into this, but I also don't like how this
> issue
> > has been portrayed and want to set the record straight.
> >
> > Scott is the ump at the NICT. His word is law in that venue.
> There
> > are even times when I get ruled against - and I should. If I
> > haven't made my intent clear enough for him to understand as a
> > fellow member of FHE, then I 'deserve' whatever judgment he feels
> is
> > best. Period. And believe me, I have....lol
> >
> > In any case, I am not in charge of what rulings come in anyone
> > else's tourney and I will not be. I am human - and it is tough
to
> > watch an ump rule differently than I intended. But in the end, I
> > have no one to blame but myself. The ump is the man, and I have
> > plenty of soccer red cards to prove it...
> >
> > Therefore, when I answer rules questions I answer them as the
> author
> > with the official answer. If someone doesn't like what their ump
> > does with that answer, I can't help that. FHE is NOT in the
> > business of telling folks how to run their events.
> >
> > <<more like exasperated b/c I really don't understand how the
rule
> > is supposed to work. I still don't understand.>>
> >
> > As you know, but fail to point out here, I have explained this
rule
> > to you on several occasions in person. You have clearly
understood
> > what I have said. I am aware that you tried to play it that you
> > could shoot your elephants over your own archers to double
frontage
> > on missile power. Who wouldn't 'want' this...? lol But don't
act
> > like I haven't already been asked this question multiple times by
> > you and don't act like you didn't get what I said. In fact, I
gave
> > you exactly the same historical reasoning for the rule that I
gave
> > here yesterday during our game in the league playoffs not more
than
> > ten days ago.
> >
> > <<Perhaps it's because I have never encountered such a rule or my
> > own ignorance,but I will tell you this, I don't blame my students
> > for not comprehending my lesson. I certainly don't ignore their
> > questions. But then again, you are not a teacher or are you? I
> plead
> > the same ignorance as Todd Kaeser. I ask for the same patience as
> > him.>>
> >
> > I am a teacher, and you know it. Todd doesn't pull this stuff -
he
> > can have whatever he wants from me. This isn't about you not
> > getting what I said and you know it.
> >
> > I'm done with this one.
> >
> > J
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
>
>
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> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Kelly Wilkinson]

lol! Hmm. . . Second Tier. . . like Ks of St. John!!

Greg Regets <greg.regets@...> wrote:
Well, if you play an army like Timurids down in South Texas, expect
to get called Miss Wilkinson. Kelly is already too close to a girl's
name. Why take that risk? ;-)

Play something second tier and save armies like that for less
experienced players. More glory to you when you win!!!!

g




--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> Good points Greg,
>
> I'm still slowly working on getting that Knights of Saint John
painted. But still considering Timurids. With a Mongol army at least
I won't need an MP when the LC evade or recall.
>
> kw
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
>
> Referees at a tournament are like officials in a sporting event.
>
> You have to go in it with the mindset that they will do a perfect
job
> at just about the same percentage that players play perfect games.
I
> have been playing since TOG 6.0 and have never once played a
perfect
> game.
>
> Also consider that the bad thing that happen to you, always looks
> worse than those that happen to everyone else ... but as there is a
> clear understanding that there will probably never be a perfectly
> refereed tournament, there are in fact bad things happening to
> everyone.
>
> It really all does tend to come out in the wash.
>
> What has really helped me the most over the years (not that I'm the
> worlds greatest player or anything) is making tactics and army
lists
> that don't rely on any single factor, in order to win. That way, if
a
> call or two doesn't go my way, there are still many other clubs in
> the bag.
>
> Thanks ... g
>
>
>
>
> - In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Jon" <JonCleaves@a...> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > ***Jon,
> > > I'm sorry that your annoyed, it's just that when "WE" here
> in
> > Kansas City are told one thing by you, the rules guru, and then
we
> > go to the NICT and it's over-ruled by Scott Holder, I am the one
> > that is more than annoyed. . .>>
> >
> > I do NOT want to get into this, but I also don't like how this
> issue
> > has been portrayed and want to set the record straight.
> >
> > Scott is the ump at the NICT. His word is law in that venue.
> There
> > are even times when I get ruled against - and I should. If I
> > haven't made my intent clear enough for him to understand as a
> > fellow member of FHE, then I 'deserve' whatever judgment he feels
> is
> > best. Period. And believe me, I have....lol
> >
> > In any case, I am not in charge of what rulings come in anyone
> > else's tourney and I will not be. I am human - and it is tough
to
> > watch an ump rule differently than I intended. But in the end, I
> > have no one to blame but myself. The ump is the man, and I have
> > plenty of soccer red cards to prove it...
> >
> > Therefore, when I answer rules questions I answer them as the
> author
> > with the official answer. If someone doesn't like what their ump
> > does with that answer, I can't help that. FHE is NOT in the
> > business of telling folks how to run their events.
> >
> > <<more like exasperated b/c I really don't understand how the
rule
> > is supposed to work. I still don't understand.>>
> >
> > As you know, but fail to point out here, I have explained this
rule
> > to you on several occasions in person. You have clearly
understood
> > what I have said. I am aware that you tried to play it that you
> > could shoot your elephants over your own archers to double
frontage
> > on missile power. Who wouldn't 'want' this...? lol But don't
act
> > like I haven't already been asked this question multiple times by
> > you and don't act like you didn't get what I said. In fact, I
gave
> > you exactly the same historical reasoning for the rule that I
gave
> > here yesterday during our game in the league playoffs not more
than
> > ten days ago.
> >
> > <<Perhaps it's because I have never encountered such a rule or my
> > own ignorance,but I will tell you this, I don't blame my students
> > for not comprehending my lesson. I certainly don't ignore their
> > questions. But then again, you are not a teacher or are you? I
> plead
> > the same ignorance as Todd Kaeser. I ask for the same patience as
> > him.>>
> >
> > I am a teacher, and you know it. Todd doesn't pull this stuff -
he
> > can have whatever he wants from me. This isn't about you not
> > getting what I said and you know it.
> >
> > I'm done with this one.
> >
> > J
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
>
>
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>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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>
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>
>
>
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>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Greg Regets]

Sure ... definately second tier (not second rate, just second tier).

Kn.of.St John has infantry and cavalry, with no overrated elephants,
or ten pages worth of list rules. The majority of the army is average
moral, and there are pretty strong minimums.

Timurid gets Panzer Tank elephants, tons of list rules, moral
upgrades where you can field an entire army that only fails waver on
a roll of 1, and almost no minimums. Clearly a top shelf army.

I'm not saying that is a bad thing that Timurid is that good ... just
saying that it is, what it is ... and at least down here, a player of
your skill shouldn't need an army that good to win.

Thanks ... g :-)



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
<jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> lol! Hmm. . . Second Tier. . . like Ks of St. John!!
>
> Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> Well, if you play an army like Timurids down in South Texas, expect
> to get called Miss Wilkinson. Kelly is already too close to a
girl's
> name. Why take that risk?
>
> Play something second tier and save armies like that for less
> experienced players. More glory to you when you win!!!!
>
> g
>
>
>
>
> --- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, kelly wilkinson
> <jwilkinson62@y...> wrote:
> > Good points Greg,
> >
> > I'm still slowly working on getting that Knights of Saint
John
> painted. But still considering Timurids. With a Mongol army at
least
> I won't need an MP when the LC evade or recall.
> >
> > kw
> >
> > Greg Regets <greg.regets@g...> wrote:
> >
> > Referees at a tournament are like officials in a sporting event.
> >
> > You have to go in it with the mindset that they will do a perfect
> job
> > at just about the same percentage that players play perfect
games.
> I
> > have been playing since TOG 6.0 and have never once played a
> perfect
> > game.
> >
> > Also consider that the bad thing that happen to you, always looks
> > worse than those that happen to everyone else ... but as there is
a
> > clear understanding that there will probably never be a perfectly
> > refereed tournament, there are in fact bad things happening to
> > everyone.
> >
> > It really all does tend to come out in the wash.
> >
> > What has really helped me the most over the years (not that I'm
the
> > worlds greatest player or anything) is making tactics and army
> lists
> > that don't rely on any single factor, in order to win. That way,
if
> a
> > call or two doesn't go my way, there are still many other clubs
in
> > the bag.
> >
> > Thanks ... g
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > - In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, "Jon" <JonCleaves@a...> wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ***Jon,
> > > > I'm sorry that your annoyed, it's just that when "WE"
here
> > in
> > > Kansas City are told one thing by you, the rules guru, and then
> we
> > > go to the NICT and it's over-ruled by Scott Holder, I am the
one
> > > that is more than annoyed. . .>>
> > >
> > > I do NOT want to get into this, but I also don't like how this
> > issue
> > > has been portrayed and want to set the record straight.
> > >
> > > Scott is the ump at the NICT. His word is law in that venue.
> > There
> > > are even times when I get ruled against - and I should. If I
> > > haven't made my intent clear enough for him to understand as a
> > > fellow member of FHE, then I 'deserve' whatever judgment he
feels
> > is
> > > best. Period. And believe me, I have....lol
> > >
> > > In any case, I am not in charge of what rulings come in anyone
> > > else's tourney and I will not be. I am human - and it is tough
> to
> > > watch an ump rule differently than I intended. But in the end,
I
> > > have no one to blame but myself. The ump is the man, and I
have
> > > plenty of soccer red cards to prove it...
> > >
> > > Therefore, when I answer rules questions I answer them as the
> > author
> > > with the official answer. If someone doesn't like what their
ump
> > > does with that answer, I can't help that. FHE is NOT in the
> > > business of telling folks how to run their events.
> > >
> > > <<more like exasperated b/c I really don't understand how the
> rule
> > > is supposed to work. I still don't understand.>>
> > >
> > > As you know, but fail to point out here, I have explained this
> rule
> > > to you on several occasions in person. You have clearly
> understood
> > > what I have said. I am aware that you tried to play it that you
> > > could shoot your elephants over your own archers to double
> frontage
> > > on missile power. Who wouldn't 'want' this...? lol But don't
> act
> > > like I haven't already been asked this question multiple times
by
> > > you and don't act like you didn't get what I said. In fact, I
> gave
> > > you exactly the same historical reasoning for the rule that I
> gave
> > > here yesterday during our game in the league playoffs not more
> than
> > > ten days ago.
> > >
> > > <<Perhaps it's because I have never encountered such a rule or
my
> > > own ignorance,but I will tell you this, I don't blame my
students
> > > for not comprehending my lesson. I certainly don't ignore their
> > > questions. But then again, you are not a teacher or are you? I
> > plead
> > > the same ignorance as Todd Kaeser. I ask for the same patience
as
> > > him.>>
> > >
> > > I am a teacher, and you know it. Todd doesn't pull this stuff -

> he
> > > can have whatever he wants from me. This isn't about you not
> > > getting what I said and you know it.
> > >
> > > I'm done with this one.
> > >
> > > J
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > WarriorRules-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
> Service.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less.
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WarriorRules/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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[John Garlic]

I'm too slow to figure out tiers. Actually, I'm pretty sure I could lose
with just about any army , so I just go for one's I like historically.
Japanese are high on my list and just might have some potential. Lotsa
pedestrians
too!

John Garlic

In a message dated 2/24/2005 4:16:03 PM Central Standard Time,
hrisikos@... writes:
> lol! Hmm. . . Second Tier. . . like Ks of St. John!!
>
> Greg Regets wrote:
> Well, if you play an army like Timurids down in South Texas, expect
> to get called Miss Wilkinson. Kelly is already too close to a girl's
> name. Why take that risk?
>
> Play something second tier and save armies like that for less
> experienced players. More glory to you when you win!!!!
>
> g
>


No,... like Greek hoplite...without even any Spartans.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Greg Regets]

That amounts to fourth or fifth tier Bill ... ;-)

We have never once doubted your cahonez in army list selection!!!

g



--- In WarriorRules@yahoogroups.com, hrisikos@D... wrote:
> > lol! Hmm. . . Second Tier. . . like Ks of St. John!!
> >
> > Greg Regets wrote:
> > Well, if you play an army like Timurids down in South Texas,
expect
> > to get called Miss Wilkinson. Kelly is already too close to a
girl's
> > name. Why take that risk?
> >
> > Play something second tier and save armies like that for less
> > experienced players. More glory to you when you win!!!!
> >
> > g
> >
>
>
> No,... like Greek hoplite...without even any Spartans.
>
>
>
>
> Greek

[Bill Chriss]

> lol! Hmm. . . Second Tier. . . like Ks of St. John!!
>
> Greg Regets wrote:
> Well, if you play an army like Timurids down in South Texas, expect
> to get called Miss Wilkinson. Kelly is already too close to a girl's
> name. Why take that risk?
>
> Play something second tier and save armies like that for less
> experienced players. More glory to you when you win!!!!
>
> g
>


No,... like Greek hoplite...without even any Spartans.




Greek